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Viewing topic "LOST MIDI connection"

     
Posted on: December 23, 2019 @ 11:28 AM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Hey guys!

It has been a while- I used to be active member, still using my Motif XS* as main keyboard and MIDI controller. I moved my studio to new location. The same 2013 custom built Windows computer. I am not sure if I saw MIDI activity since I moved- I thought- I did, but maybe not. Yes, USB is plugged to different port than it used to be but Motif was always stable- it survived every Windows update! I will copy my post to Cakewalk community- the DAW of my choice and a link if allowed to discussion so you can see what was already suggested. Thank you so much for your help!

This is emergency, because- well- I am a keyboardist and Yamaha Motif XS8 is my main MIDI instrument and I use a lot of MIDI. I have no MIDI signal on MIDI track. Yes, the blue light on a track is on (Input Echo). I have Yamaha XS Ins and Outs showing in Devices for Audio and MIDI, computer is making connected/disconnected sounds when connect/disconnect USB cable, Cakewalk asks if I want to re-route devices when connected/disconnected- everything looks normal, but no signal. The MIDI track is dead. I have this board from 2008. With Windows updates, I lost USB connection from V-Synth GT and Fantom G- Roland decided to not update their drivers. But Yamaha was always stable. It was always on, soon as I load any project on any MIDI channel- it always worked. I am panicking wondering if Windows did some update that caused it. I did check another USB port and another USB cable. We recently moved and I was not using a studio in a new place, so configuration could of change. I also loaded voices bank that was saved as “All data” and all my MIDI settings were wiped out. But I have it set MIDI to USB, Local Off. They are very simple settings. I checked everything 20 times. I dont understand why I can’t make it work. Any thoughts? Thank you. 

https://discuss.cakewalk.com/index.php?/topic/9826-lost-usb-midi-from-yamaha-motif-xs8/&_fromLogin=1#replyForm

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Posted on: December 23, 2019 @ 04:14 PM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  11350
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend

Which Windows OS is installed on the computer?

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Posted on: December 24, 2019 @ 09:39 PM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Hey there

The computer is Windows 10, updated.

I now clearly remember that I did have MIDI working recently (after moving my studio gear to another location_ because I had weird MIDI LOOP issue that would make all Motif patterns play super fast.

What I did is I recently loaded one of Motifatoir sound banks, and it was saved as “All Data”, so it overwrote all my MIDI settings. I think- the issue may be there. I have MIDI set to USB. Local Off. The device ID was for some reason 4, but I tried to change it to- 1? Off? What else in settings can prevent MIDI from being sent/received? Thank you.

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Posted on: December 24, 2019 @ 11:40 PM
5pinDIN
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Astral - 24 December 2019 09:39 PM

Hey there

The computer is Windows 10, updated.

I now clearly remember that I did have MIDI working recently (after moving my studio gear to another location_ because I had weird MIDI LOOP issue that would make all Motif patterns play super fast.

OK. Just to be sure, you should verify that one of the following USB-MIDI drivers is installed (depending on whether Win 10 is 32-bit or 64-bit).
https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/umd_win32_kbd.html
https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/umd_win64_kbd.html

If you reinstall the driver, check MIDI operation again.

 

Astral -

What I did is I recently loaded one of Motifatoir sound banks, and it was saved as “All Data”, so it overwrote all my MIDI settings. I think- the issue may be there. I have MIDI set to USB. Local Off. The device ID was for some reason 4, but I tried to change it to- 1? Off? What else in settings can prevent MIDI from being sent/received? Thank you.

If there was not a driver issue, I suggest that you do a factory reset (see page 22 of the XS Owner’s Manual). Then set MIDI In/Out in Utility mode to USB and STORE it, and see if that resolves the problem. If MIDI is OK, you can then reload the “All” file, but do so with Type set to ”all without system”. That Type setting prevents an “All” file from overwriting Utility and Sequencer settings, leaving your own MIDI and other settings intact.

Let us know if the problem gets resolved or not.

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Posted on: December 25, 2019 @ 08:44 AM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Thank you for your reply. The drivers on Yamaha site are from 2015. This system definitely was working recently. Can the driver go bad?

Where can I get a manual for XS? Could you, maybe just tell me where the reset located- is it in Utility? Thank you.

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Posted on: December 25, 2019 @ 08:58 AM
5pinDIN
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Astral - 25 December 2019 08:44 AM

Thank you for your reply.

You’re welcome.

 

Astral -

The drivers on Yamaha site are from 2015. This system definitely was working recently. Can the driver go bad?

The driver can’t “go bad” by itself, but since we don’t know what the exact cause of the problem is, I provided links.

 

Astral -

Where can I get a manual for XS? Could you, maybe just tell me where the reset located- is it in Utility? Thank you.

See…
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/479012/
...for both the reset procedure and a link to the manual.

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Posted on: December 28, 2019 @ 03:39 PM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Thank you for the info. I just did Factory Reset on Motif, and nothing. Tested with Arturia Analog Lab- still no MIDI. Considering to attempt to install the driver again but not sure it is a good idea. Do I need to uninstall old driver? I did not want to mass with the driver because until now- everything was working- if I change driver, then I would not know if it is driver or keyboard. I have another computer in different location but this is 88keys heavy instrument and I would have to drag it to another studio to test. (I am a girl). But it probably better than just risk and mass with the driver right now. This would tell me if it is computer or the keyboard… Obviously it is not only Cakewalk issue. Any thoughts? Thank you.

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Posted on: December 28, 2019 @ 06:18 PM
5pinDIN
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Joined  09-16-2010
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While it’s not impossible, it’s unlikely that a problem with the XS8 itself is causing MIDI difficulties.

1) Did you set MIDI In/Out in Utility mode to USB and STORE it? If not, do so and recheck operation.

2) With the XS8 powered up and set for USB MIDI operation, you can check for driver installation by opening the Windows Control Panel and double-clicking on “Yamaha USB-MIDI Driver”. A Window should open, and “Device” should indicate “Motif XS8”. You should see the OUT and IN ports connected with a one-to-one correspondence - that is, “OUT 1” to “1”, “OUT 2” to “2”, etc., and the same for “IN 1”, and so on. Try sending “All Note ON” and “All Note OFF” - the XS8 should respond.

3) If the USB-MIDI driver isn’t found, or there’s any other concern about its operation, just reinstall it. Be sure to use the correct 32- or 64-bit version. There shouldn’t be any risk if you follow the steps in the Installation Guide PDF that comes with the download

4) If there’s still a problem, post again. There are some tests that could be run.

By the way, do you have a 5-pin MIDI cable?

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: December 28, 2019 @ 06:48 PM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Thank you for your reply. I am on another computer right now that also has USB- MIDI driver installed, but Motif is not in this studio. Should I be able to see driver if Motif is not connected? Where would it be? I am looking under Control Panel/All Items and dont see it. (Again- this is another computer, but newer and I was using Motif here as well). Thank you.

I have some audio interface that has 5 pin MIDI in/out I would have to find it and connect if I have to- so technically- yes, I have, and I sure have a cable. lol.

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Posted on: December 28, 2019 @ 10:12 PM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

Ok, I am back by Motif. The driver is there and I can open Device and see Out and In ports connected, and I can send Note On and Note off and it plays a note and stops it. So the driver is ok? Now what is wrong? Thank you.

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Posted on: December 28, 2019 @ 10:15 PM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

And now it working! I did not change anything! The only thing I did was open the Driver and sent Note On and Note Off. This is bizarre! But thank you! You saved my Motif! Appreciate it very much!

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Posted on: December 29, 2019 @ 05:05 AM
5pinDIN
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Astral - 28 December 2019 10:15 PM

And now it working! I did not change anything! The only thing I did was open the Driver and sent Note On and Note Off. This is bizarre! But thank you! You saved my Motif! Appreciate it very much!

You’re welcome - but please don’t ask me to explain what happened!  :-)

Windows 10 can apparently play havoc with MIDI at times. It’s often difficult for equipment manufacturers to keep drivers current with computer OS updates. Computers I use with my own gear have Windows XP Pro installed because it works well for my needs. Those computers are never connected online, so I don’t have to be concerned with possible security issues with such an older OS. I realize that approach might not be practical for everyone, so putting up with strange behavior may just be a part of dealing with your gear nowadays.

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Posted on: December 29, 2019 @ 08:59 AM
Astral
Total Posts:  1167
Joined  01-26-2007
status: Guru

While I sympathize with manufacturers, I think it is their responsibility to assure that the product can be used and has reasonable life expectancy that correlates with the price. If it becomes difficult to keep up with drivers, such a powerful company as Yamaha should address it with Microsoft or have strong support department that able to handle changing environment.  Roland, for example, completely abandoned their products before Windows 10 and they do not work.I have Roland V-Synth GT for which I paid 3,000$ and Fantom G for which I paid $2800, and only few years in to use Roland decided they will not update USB drives any more. So I cant use those as controllers unless I have 5 pin MIDI interface. This is not acceptable. Yamaha driver was always working and I do not know what their secret and why driver released in 2015 is still working despite all changes. And why Roland chose not to update driver- this must be commercial decision to force us in to buying new gear. This is not fair practice. Glad it works with Yamaha. Thank you again.

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Posted on: December 29, 2019 @ 12:10 PM
5pinDIN
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I hope you don’t think that I was defending any synth manufacturer which doesn’t provide support of their products for a reasonable period. Unfortunately, too many companies seem to have a policy of weighing the value of loyal users versus the profits of selling a new model, and they may decide that old customers can be sacrificed.

Modern synths are typically based on computer technology, but unlike computers they don’t become obsolete in 3-5 years. A synth is a musical instrument that can produce useful sounds for many years (often decades), even as the popular genre changes over time.

Maybe if musicians would stop buying products from companies which discontinue support too soon, the message might get through.

However, how do we get Microsoft and Apple to also understand the life span issue? Perhaps complaints never reach anyone who makes decisions, or musical applications are used by too small a percentage of their users for MS and Apple to care.

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Posted on: February 24, 2020 @ 12:44 AM
TreHolla
Total Posts:  28
Joined  01-03-2005
status: Regular
5pinDIN - 28 December 2019 06:18 PM

While it’s not impossible, it’s unlikely that a problem with the XS8 itself is causing MIDI difficulties.

1) Did you set MIDI In/Out in Utility mode to USB and STORE it? If not, do so and recheck operation.

2) With the XS8 powered up and set for USB MIDI operation, you can check for driver installation by opening the Windows Control Panel and double-clicking on “Yamaha USB-MIDI Driver”. A Window should open, and “Device” should indicate “Motif XS8”. You should see the OUT and IN ports connected with a one-to-one correspondence - that is, “OUT 1” to “1”, “OUT 2” to “2”, etc., and the same for “IN 1”, and so on. Try sending “All Note ON” and “All Note OFF” - the XS8 should respond.

3) If the USB-MIDI driver isn’t found, or there’s any other concern about its operation, just reinstall it. Be sure to use the correct 32- or 64-bit version. There shouldn’t be any risk if you follow the steps in the Installation Guide PDF that comes with the download

4) If there’s still a problem, post again. There are some tests that could be run.

By the way, do you have a 5-pin MIDI cable?

Seriously, thank you for your help with a post like this. I’ve been looking for drivers for my Motif ES6 for quite some time. I’m just recently starting to set up all my equipment in a midi manner after making all my music without midi for about twenty years.

I have zero clue when it comes to all things midi for the most part. I’m so late to this part of music production.

Again thank you.

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Posted on: February 24, 2020 @ 06:56 PM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  11350
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend
TreHolla - 24 February 2020 12:44 AM
5pinDIN - 28 December 2019 06:18 PM

While it’s not impossible, it’s unlikely that a problem with the XS8 itself is causing MIDI difficulties.

1) Did you set MIDI In/Out in Utility mode to USB and STORE it? If not, do so and recheck operation.

2) With the XS8 powered up and set for USB MIDI operation, you can check for driver installation by opening the Windows Control Panel and double-clicking on “Yamaha USB-MIDI Driver”. A Window should open, and “Device” should indicate “Motif XS8”. You should see the OUT and IN ports connected with a one-to-one correspondence - that is, “OUT 1” to “1”, “OUT 2” to “2”, etc., and the same for “IN 1”, and so on. Try sending “All Note ON” and “All Note OFF” - the XS8 should respond.

3) If the USB-MIDI driver isn’t found, or there’s any other concern about its operation, just reinstall it. Be sure to use the correct 32- or 64-bit version. There shouldn’t be any risk if you follow the steps in the Installation Guide PDF that comes with the download

4) If there’s still a problem, post again. There are some tests that could be run.

By the way, do you have a 5-pin MIDI cable?

Seriously, thank you for your help with a post like this. I’ve been looking for drivers for my Motif ES6 for quite some time. I’m just recently starting to set up all my equipment in a midi manner after making all my music without midi for about twenty years.

I have zero clue when it comes to all things midi for the most part. I’m so late to this part of music production.

Again thank you.

Thanks for the kind words.

Firmware, software, and manuals for the ES can be found here:
https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/index.html?c=music_production&k=ES

https://usa.yamaha.com/products/contents/music_production/downloads/manuals/index.html?l=en&c=music_production&k=motif+es

https://usa.yamaha.com/support/docs_data/index.html?l=en&c=music_production&k=motif+es

If you need help with getting your gear to behave with MIDI, just ask. It’s probably best to post anything further specific to the ES in its own Motifator forum…
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/index.php/viewforum/113/
...since answers can often be dependent on model.

Have fun!  :-)

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