Hi,

On my MOTIF XS I’m trying to clear a pattern using the ‘Clear Pattern’ job.

More specifically, I’m trying to clear a particular Pattern Section (i.e. Letter E).

Though I execute the job and am told it is complete, the Pattern Section remains and is not cleared.

Do I misunderstand something?  Is there a trick to it?  Is this a known bug?  Does this work (or not work) for other people?  Is there a recommended work-around?

Thanks to whomever can shed some light on this!

P.S.  I took some pics of the process, but for some reason they don’t show up when I attach them via the Browse ... button. (?)

First things first, did you STORE your changes?

sj1 - 27 May 2019 09:58 AM

Hi,

On my MOTIF XS I’m trying to clear a pattern using the ‘Clear Pattern’ job.

More specifically, I’m trying to clear a particular Pattern Section (i.e. Letter E).

Though I execute the job and am told it is complete, the Pattern Section remains and is not cleared.

Do I misunderstand something?  Is there a trick to it?  Is this a known bug?  Does this work (or not work) for other people?  Is there a recommended work-around?

Thanks to whomever can shed some light on this!

Immediately after applying the Clear Pattern Job it will appear that there’s no change. The reason the Pattern/Section appears to not be cleared at first is that it’s retained in the buffer. That way the “Undo” Job can be applied if the Pattern/Section was cleared unintentionally.

However, if you select another Pattern and then return to the cleared one, you’ll see that the Job was indeed completed. Once that’s done, “Undo” will no longer work.

 

sj1 -

P.S.  I took some pics of the process, but for some reason they don’t show up when I attach them via the Browse ... button. (?)

Attachments are limited both in size and file extension. If the pictures are small enough, they should attach if ZIPPED.

cmayhle - 27 May 2019 01:13 PM

First things first, did you STORE your changes?

Unfortunately, if the Pattern is STORED while the cleared Pattern/Section is still showing on the display, that will effectively cancel what was cleared.

5pinDIN - 27 May 2019 01:18 PM

Immediately after applying the Clear Pattern Job it will appear that there’s no change. The reason the Pattern/Section appears to not be cleared at first is that it’s retained in the buffer. That way the “Undo” Job can be applied if the Pattern/Section was cleared unintentionally.

However, if you select another Pattern and then return to the cleared one, you’ll see that the Job was indeed completed. Once that’s done, “Undo” will no longer work.

Very interesting (if counterintuitive), and I confirm it as written.  Thank you kindly!

I also note that when leaving that first pattern, the message “The edited sequence data will be discarded.  Are you sure?  No/Yes” appears.  Selecting “Yes” is the gateway to allow you to change patterns (and then come back and see your cleared Section). 

If you select “No”, the attempt to change patterns is aborted, leaving you where you started.  In this case, you will still see the supposedly cleared Section as present (and are still able to play it), and you will also see the purple E (for “edited") in the upper right corner, though there does not seem to be anything specific to tell you that the “edit” is a Section still present but primed to disappear when you change Pattern and say “Yes” on the way out.

5pinDIN - 27 May 2019 01:26 PM

Unfortunately, if the Pattern is STORED while the cleared Pattern/Section is still showing on the display, that will effectively cancel what was cleared.

Ha, I confirm that too!

So along the same line, I observe that if you copy a Section from the current Pattern to a different Pattern, then you will see what you expect (i.e. the presence of the copied info) as soon as you inspect the destination pattern (this because you have to -change- patterns to visit the destination).  You will also see that Undo is not possible in this case.

5pinDIN - 27 May 2019 01:26 PM

Unfortunately, if the Pattern is STORED while the cleared Pattern/Section is still showing on the display, that will effectively cancel what was cleared.

To make things even more convoluted, if your just-completed job was a Copy rather than a Clear, the Store button does make it take!

IOW, Store (with “Yes") aborts a Clear, but finalizes a Copy.

All my observations here are with OS v 1.60.1.

sj1 - 27 May 2019 04:20 PM

5pinDIN - 27 May 2019 01:18 PM

Immediately after applying the Clear Pattern Job it will appear that there’s no change. The reason the Pattern/Section appears to not be cleared at first is that it’s retained in the buffer. That way the “Undo” Job can be applied if the Pattern/Section was cleared unintentionally.

However, if you select another Pattern and then return to the cleared one, you’ll see that the Job was indeed completed. Once that’s done, “Undo” will no longer work.

Very interesting (if counterintuitive), and I confirm it as written.  Thank you kindly!

You’re welcome.

 

sj1 -

I also note that when leaving that first pattern, the message “The edited sequence data will be discarded.  Are you sure?  No/Yes” appears.  Selecting “Yes” is the gateway to allow you to change patterns (and then come back and see your cleared Section).

That message doesn’t appear unless you’ve done editing other than clearing a Pattern/Section, at least with version 1.60 of the OS - I don’t remember if it was any different with earlier versions.

 

sj1 -

If you select “No”, the attempt to change patterns is aborted, leaving you where you started.  In this case, you will still see the supposedly cleared Section as present (and are still able to play it), and you will also see the purple E (for “edited") in the upper right corner, though there does not seem to be anything specific to tell you that the “edit” is a Section still present but primed to disappear when you change Pattern and say “Yes” on the way out.

The ”E” doesn’t appear unless a change other than clearing a Pattern/Section has been done.

EDIT: The warning message and ”E” will appear if the default check mark is removed from “Clear Pattern Chain”.

5pinDIN - 27 May 2019 01:26 PM

cmayhle - 27 May 2019 01:13 PM

First things first, did you STORE your changes?

Unfortunately, if the Pattern is STORED while the cleared Pattern/Section is still showing on the display, that will effectively cancel what was cleared.

Well that is really interesting.  I haven’t any doubt you’ll be able to clear this up 5pinDIN, but on page 223 of the Owner’s Manual, under Pattern Job Procedure #6 it states:

CAUTION Even if a Job operation has been completed, selecting a
different Pattern or turning the power off without storing will
erase the Pattern data. Make sure to store the Pattern data to
internal memory by pressing the [STORE] button before
selecting a different Pattern or turning the power off.

This seems to contradict the empirical excersise you noted of going to a different pattern and returning before STORING.

EDIT:  Never mind, I see in the OP’s 2nd post there is an intermediate yes/no question that seems to effectively “STORE” the change.  Wish my XF didn’t live most of its life in an equipment trailer so I could actually test more stuff!

cmayhle - 28 May 2019 01:19 AM

Well that is really interesting.  I haven’t any doubt you’ll be able to clear this up 5pinDIN, but on page 223 of the Owner’s Manual, under Pattern Job Procedure #6 it states:

CAUTION Even if a Job operation has been completed, selecting a
different Pattern or turning the power off without storing will
erase the Pattern data. Make sure to store the Pattern data to
internal memory by pressing the [STORE] button before
selecting a different Pattern or turning the power off.

This seems to contradict the empirical excersise you noted of going to a different pattern and returning before STORING.

EDIT:  Never mind, I see in the OP’s 2nd post there is an intermediate yes/no question that seems to effectively “STORE” the change.  Wish my XF didn’t live most of its life in an equipment trailer so I could actually test more stuff!

That YES/NO warning message doesn’t appear if only a Pattern/Section has been cleared. See my third post, including the EDIT.

When a Program (Voice, Performance, Song, Pattern) is initially selected, the contents are copied into the Edit Buffer. Any editing is usually done on the data in that buffer, not on the location from which the data was taken. “Usually”, because apparently that’s not always the case…
From the Owner’s Manual, page 223, step #5:
CAUTION
In some Jobs, the operation overwrites any data previously
existing in the destination memory. Important data should
always be saved to a USB storage device connected to the
USB TO DEVICE terminal or to a computer connected to the
same network as the MOTIF XS (page 278).

It appears that in the case of the Clear Pattern Job, the User memory location (not the Edit Buffer) is directly altered. Based on the “CAUTION”, I suppose this would be called a “quirk” rather than a “bug”.

If nothing else, the Motifs are somewhat inconsistent.  :-)