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Viewing topic "11 Performance Parts in Master Mode"

     
Posted on: May 07, 2019 @ 08:39 AM
lastmonk
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Total Posts:  224
Joined  12-17-2013
status: Enthusiast

I had a Performance assigned to a Master Mode.

I’m using Zone Control, and Zone Switch on.

The 4 Parts from the Performance are being controlled by the 1rst fader.

Originally I was sending the other 7 faders to external synths, but I decided to try
to send the faders to the Motif and so I use MSB,LSB, Program Number, and associated each of the
7 Zones to a different Channel.

Now I have 4 Performance voices on fader 1, and 7 other Motif voices each assigned to their own
fader for a total of 11 voices.

I know that with a Mix voice you can have up to 16 separately controlled voices that can be assigned to the same song or pattern number.  But these separately controlled voices don’t sound at the same time if they’re on a different channel.  Also in a Mix voice you can have as many as 16 voices assigned to a single channel so that they all sound simultaneously.  But if you want to have live dynamic volume control over individual voices when they’re all assigned to the same channel that can be a tricky proposition during a live performance.

Using this Master Mode Approach I can have at least 8 voices sounding simultaneously with the ability to easily control which voices sound when using the faders.

So in effect you can have an 11 Part Performance in Master Mode LOL.

The more I dig into my Motif, the I more appreciate its beauty.  I think I’m just beginning to see the possibilities for Midi programming using the Motif’s Master Mode.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 07, 2019 @ 10:10 AM
5pinDIN
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Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend

Master Mode seems to be elusive to some users. So that others can see how you programmed the above, it would be appreciated if you would post an “All” file as an example. If you do so, please base it on a factory reset XF, save “without sample”, and ZIP the file. Thanks.

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Posted on: May 07, 2019 @ 02:35 PM
lastmonk
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Joined  12-17-2013
status: Enthusiast

I can’t post an all file based on a factory reset XF (at the moment) Perhaps at a later date.

But I can say it was easy.

The Zone Transmit Channels can stay 1 - 8.

The Internal and External Switch for Zone 1 remain unchecked.  Zone 1, Fader 1 is where the original Performance is accessed.

Under the Preset Tab (while in edit for master mode) I set the

MSB
LSB
Program Change

on zones 2-8 for the each of the addition 7 voices I wanted to use.  For example on Zone 4 I wanted to use the Velo Growl Legato ( a sax voice).  So in Preset tab for Zone 4 I entered:

MSB 063
LSB 004
Program Change 10

Under the Preset Tab I made sure that “Midi Send” was highlighted.

I made sure the Int Switch was checked for Zones 2-8 and the Ext switch (was unchecked) for zones 2-8. 

Under the TX Switch tab I made sure Int Bank Select and Int Program Change were both selected for each of the zones 2-8.

I hit store. 

That’s it!

I guess once I realized I could send the program change to channels on my internal switch. The light bulb went on.  So all one needs is the Data List with the MSB, LSB and Program Change information.  Set that info up in the preset tab for master mode, make sure int switch is checked, midi send is highlighted and leave the performance mode Zone (Zone 1) Unchecked for both int and ext.  and under TX switch tab make sure Int Bank Select and In Program Change is checked for any zones you want to use and Its pretty straightforward.

I’ve got too much going on right now in terms of custom voices, samples, etc to risk a program reset and reload or I would have posted an .all file.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 07, 2019 @ 07:12 PM
5pinDIN
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Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend
lastmonk - 07 May 2019 02:35 PM

The Zone Transmit Channels can stay 1 - 8.

The Internal and External Switch for Zone 1 remain unchecked.  Zone 1, Fader 1 is where the original Performance is accessed.

Under the Preset Tab (while in edit for master mode) I set the

MSB
LSB
Program Change

on zones 2-8 for the each of the addition 7 voices I wanted to use.  For example on Zone 4 I wanted to use the Velo Growl Legato ( a sax voice).  So in Preset tab for Zone 4 I entered:

MSB 063
LSB 004
Program Change 10

Under the Preset Tab I made sure that “Midi Send” was highlighted.


I made sure the Int Switch was checked for Zones 2-8 and the Ext switch (was unchecked) for zones 2-8. 

Under the TX Switch tab I made sure Int Bank Select and Int Program Change were both selected for each of the zones 2-8.

I hit store. 

That’s it!

Perhaps I misinterpreted something, because I can’t duplicate the above and obtain the results you initially posted.

I can accomplish the same goal, but with seemingly somewhat different programming. I don’t want to steal your thunder, but if there’s interest, I could post an “All” file with an example of my own approach.

Under any circumstance, it would be interesting to see what you did, so when you have the opportunity, please do post a file.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 08, 2019 @ 05:04 AM
maxweb
Total Posts:  73
Joined  01-06-2004
status: Experienced

It could be interesting to have more info.

Max
Motif XF

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Posted on: May 08, 2019 @ 07:55 PM
lastmonk
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Joined  12-17-2013
status: Enthusiast
maxweb - 08 May 2019 05:04 AM

It could be interesting to have more info.

Max
Motif XF

For sure I’ll be happy to post an all file.  I have a show that I’m programming for on June 1rst, so I don’t want to screw around with resetting my Motif.  Although I do have backups and there shouldn’t be a problem, I don’t want to temp fate.  But I’ll definitely post a file the next day.

But for sure, I’m very very happy with the results and I intend to use them in my show on the first.  I’ve routinely been using mix voices to give me up to 16 different sounds in a single song or pattern.  I’ve been able to do splits, assign multiple voices to several channels in the same song or pattern and things worked fine.  But I ran into issues when I needed to dynamically change volumes for multiple sounds that were assigned to the same channel.

With this new approach I can now have 8 sounds in a master mode setup and I can use the faders to control the volume for each sound.  So its just another reason for me to assert the Motif can get it done.

5pinDin so what issue are you having?  I’m actually now setting up multiple Master Mode settings with this approach for my upcoming show.

And I don’t have any thunder to steal. My initial information that got me started came from:

http://www.motifator.com/index.php/support/view/understanding_motif_xs_master_mode

I was able to extrapolate from there.

I’ll check my post again to make sure I didn’t leave anything out.  The only thing that I didn’t include in my post was my midi cabling, which shouldn’t have anything to do with the setup.  But for those that are curious My Motif at this time is connected to a QY100.

I was initially using it as one of the external midi devices.  But in my new setup I have all ext-switch unchecked.

Anywho, I’ll double check the values that I put in my post, and post any changes if necessary, and will definitely post an all file after my show!

Cheers!

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 08, 2019 @ 08:12 PM
lastmonk
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Total Posts:  224
Joined  12-17-2013
status: Enthusiast

I just checked my setup again.  There is one correction to my post on the setting.

Zone 1, which is being used to control the original 4 voice performance should have int switch checked.  In my previous post I had that both int switch and the ext switch where unchecked that is
incorrect.  The int switch is checked and ext switch is unchecked.

So the 4 voices for the original performance are all controlled by the first fader which is controlled by Zone 1.

Zone 2 thru Zone 8 each control a separate Motif Voice.  The voices for each of those zones were set with MSB, LSB and Program Change, and midi send highlighted and int switch checked.

The other two parameters that I didn’t mention in my previous post was:

Zone Switch = on
Knob Control Assign = Zone

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 09, 2019 @ 05:41 AM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  10916
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend
lastmonk - 08 May 2019 08:12 PM

I just checked my setup again.  There is one correction to my post on the setting.

Zone 1, which is being used to control the original 4 voice performance should have int switch checked.  In my previous post I had that both int switch and the ext switch where unchecked that is
incorrect.  The int switch is checked and ext switch is unchecked.

So the 4 voices for the original performance are all controlled by the first fader which is controlled by Zone 1.

Zone 2 thru Zone 8 each control a separate Motif Voice.  The voices for each of those zones were set with MSB, LSB and Program Change, and midi send highlighted and int switch checked.


The other two parameters that I didn’t mention in my previous post was:

Zone Switch = on
Knob Control Assign = Zone

Thanks for the correction and additional information. My own approach already included them, but others attempting to duplicate this technique will likely appreciate that.

If you don’t mind, some additional observations…
You initially posted “I had a Performance assigned to a Master Mode”. Since directly associating a Master with a Performance wouldn’t work as described, I used the Song Mix Job “Copy Performance”, copying to Parts 1~4 - I suspect you did similarly. That leaves Parts 5~16 available for other Voices.

I also turned on “Parameter with Voice” for Part 2 and higher. While this setting ensures that Parts selected in the Master via MSB/LSB/PC Preset will be as complete as the original Voice, I’d consider it optional. It may not always be desirable, since including things such as Arps might not be wanted in some cases.

In the Master, Mode was set to “Song”. Zone 1 was set to Transmit Channel 1, which then covered the copied Performance. For Zones 2~8 I set the Transmit Channel to 5~11, respectively - that is, Zone 2 to Channel 5, Zone 3 to Channel 6, etc. - in order to avoid the Channels occupied by the 4 Parts of the Performance.

If you did differently, please let us know - the more info, the better.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: May 09, 2019 @ 09:55 AM
lastmonk
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Total Posts:  224
Joined  12-17-2013
status: Enthusiast
5pinDIN - 09 May 2019 05:41 AM
lastmonk - 08 May 2019 08:12 PM

I just checked my setup again.  There is one correction to my post on the setting.

Zone 1, which is being used to control the original 4 voice performance should have int switch checked.  In my previous post I had that both int switch and the ext switch where unchecked that is
incorrect.  The int switch is checked and ext switch is unchecked.

So the 4 voices for the original performance are all controlled by the first fader which is controlled by Zone 1.

Zone 2 thru Zone 8 each control a separate Motif Voice.  The voices for each of those zones were set with MSB, LSB and Program Change, and midi send highlighted and int switch checked.


The other two parameters that I didn’t mention in my previous post was:

Zone Switch = on
Knob Control Assign = Zone

Thanks for the correction and additional information. My own approach already included them, but others attempting to duplicate this technique will likely appreciate that.

If you don’t mind, some additional observations…
You initially posted “I had a Performance assigned to a Master Mode”. Since directly associating a Master with a Performance wouldn’t work as described, I used the Song Mix Job “Copy Performance”, copying to Parts 1~4 - I suspect you did similarly. That leaves Parts 5~16 available for other Voices.

I also turned on “Parameter with Voice” for Part 2 and higher. While this setting ensures that Parts selected in the Master via MSB/LSB/PC Preset will be as complete as the original Voice, I’d consider it optional. It may not always be desirable, since including things such as Arps might not be wanted in some cases.

In the Master, Mode was set to “Song”. Zone 1 was set to Transmit Channel 1, which then covered the copied Performance. For Zones 2~8 I set the Transmit Channel to 5~11, respectively - that is, Zone 2 to Channel 5, Zone 3 to Channel 6, etc. - in order to avoid the Channels occupied by the 4 Parts of the Performance.

If you did differently, please let us know - the more info, the better.

You are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!!!!!!!

I was just logging in to post some changes and seen your post!

Yes, my original post was really incomplete. I looked back at things late last night., and realized:

First of all

I left off the step of converting my original performance to a Song! My entire post needed to be adjusted for the fact that while in Song mode, I copied my Performance to Tracks 1-4 and that Song is the thing that I assigned to the Master mode.  Without that step, OMG no wonder you guys couldn’t replicate!

So while I’m thinking performance, and because my original problem started out in performance mode, I neglected to post the fact that I had already copied my performance to a song.  And Master Mode is “DEFINITELY” set to song.

Second., All of the voices I was working with in my original performance were custom voices where I have played all kinds of tricks with the elements of each voice.  So I certainly was hearing the number of voices that I posted BUT!!! there were a few other subtle things going on.

You’re also right the ."all file” would have cleared up the miscommunication right off the bat.  Because as soon as I tried to replicate the whole process with stock voices using only the steps in my post KaPOW!  LOL

So excuse me for my sloppy post, and 5pinDIN thanx much for pointing that out and forcing me to be more clear.

So I was so busy thinking about the progress I had made with getting my performance parts + 7 other sounds that I over looked that with a little thought, since I’m already using mix voices (more or less) with a song in master mode, I could get even more sounds.

So I’m even happier now than I was a couple of days ago.

So once I learn the difference between starting off in performance mode, and the difference between counting elements vs counting parts :-( I’ll be okay LOL

But the fact remains Master Mode lets one overcome the 4 voice layer control issues nicely.

Thanx for your post it is very valuable knowledge as always!

Here’s to candles in the dark

Cheers

  [ Ignore ]