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Viewing topic "MOXF8 hangs (crashes?) when selecting SONG number 64"

     
Posted on: January 08, 2019 @ 02:10 PM
Davelet
Total Posts:  52
Joined  07-27-2017
status: Experienced

Hi All

I have developed a strange problem with my 1.5 year-old MOXF8.

I was having a bit of a clear-out of unused songs and patterns on my MOXF8 this evening, scrolling through them and deleting the ones I no longer needed.

All was going well until I reached song number 64 in SONG mode, when the MOXF8 hung (i.e., “crashed"). I could no longer change the song number (it was stuck on 64), and none of the front panel buttons worked either - e.g., I couldn’t switch to VOICE or indeed any other mode.

I power-cycled the MOXF8 and it was fine again, with the front panel controls (and keyboard) responsive again. So I thought I’d go into SONG mode again and try selecting song number 64 with the data wheel. Again, once I reached 64 it crashed again and I had to power cycle it again.

I tried the above again a couple more times with the same result.

The sequencer memory (after my clear out) was at about 5%.

I haven’t (yet) tried a factory reset. Before I do so, I wondered if anyone had come across this before and, if so, had any ideas as to what might be causing it?

Best

David.

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Posted on: January 08, 2019 @ 03:30 PM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  10677
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend

I’m personally unaware of that particular problem, but I don’t own a MOXF. I also suspect that the majority of users likely don’t have all 64 Song locations filled. You may have found a previously unreported bug.

There are some known freezing problems in older versions of the OS. To check the OS version of a MOXF…
Press the [UTILITY] button, then press [JOB]. Read the “Firm” displayed. Ignore the second decimal point and any number following it.

The most recent version is 1.12 - if yours isn’t that one, you can get it here:
https://usa.yamaha.com/support/updates/moxf6_moxf8_os_updater.html

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: January 09, 2019 @ 07:24 AM
Davelet
Total Posts:  52
Joined  07-27-2017
status: Experienced

Thanks 5pinDIN for the reply. Yes, I am using the latest firmware version.

Maybe I’ll try a factory reset but now I’ve had my clear-out of my songs and patterns there isn’t any need to go to high song numbers anymore (at least, not until I fill them up again!) so I might put up with it.

I need to send the MOXF back for repair anyway (it’s within the 2 year warranty) as quite a few keys have become annoyingly loose and wobbly so I’ll likely mention it then (if the factory reset doesn’t sort it).

David.

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Posted on: January 10, 2019 @ 05:22 AM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  10677
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend

You’re welcome.

If you haven’t yet done a factory reset, it might be interesting to try something. Select a Song other than #64, STORE it to Song location 64, then see if Song 64 can be selected without freezing. If that works, then it would appear the previous data for Song 64 had somehow been corrupted. Please let us know the outcome if you try this.

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Posted on: January 11, 2019 @ 12:27 PM
Davelet
Total Posts:  52
Joined  07-27-2017
status: Experienced

HI 5pinDIN

Many thanks for the suggestion. I just tried it and the song copied over successfully to location 64, but still when I selected location 64 the MOXF8 again hung/crashed.

I might try a factory reset next - or more likely, just park it, and avoid location 64, and mention it when I take it in for repair.

Thanks again

David.

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Posted on: January 11, 2019 @ 08:03 PM
Stephen Kay
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Total Posts:  169
Joined  01-13-2011
status: Pro

I’m betting that a factory reset solves the problem. Must be something corrupted about the data related to that song slot. Also, I’m not sure if you mentioned it, but make sure nothing is connected via midi while you are selecting the song. Might be some kind of a MIDI feedback loop.

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Posted on: January 13, 2019 @ 03:09 AM
Davelet
Total Posts:  52
Joined  07-27-2017
status: Experienced

Hi Stephen

Good call on the MIDI feedback thing! So, the problem only occurs when I have my MIDI patchbay turned on AND my computer connected via USB so I think you may well be right. I can’t say it’s MIDI feedback for sure, but it looks like it may well be a candidate.

Debugging it might take a while, however, as my setup with the patchbay is so darn complicated that I have to draw diagrams all the time to work out what is talking to what (drawback of having six keyboards and 4 hardware synth modules, plus the computer … maybe time for a downsize).

Curious why it only occurs on Song 64, though! I still haven’t done the factory reset. Despite having backup after backup it terrifies me.

David.

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Posted on: January 13, 2019 @ 07:13 AM
5pinDIN
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Total Posts:  10677
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Legend
Davelet - 13 January 2019 03:09 AM

Hi Stephen

Good call on the MIDI feedback thing! So, the problem only occurs when I have my MIDI patchbay turned on AND my computer connected via USB so I think you may well be right. I can’t say it’s MIDI feedback for sure, but it looks like it may well be a candidate.

Interesting. I intentionally set up MIDI feedback with my XF through MIDI-OX, so that I could monitor messages as well as see if selecting Song 64 caused any problems. Each time a Song is selected the XF outputs two messages, F3 Song Select and F2 Song Position Pointer. At least with the XF, nothing seemed amiss when selecting #64 - the Song number changed, and the echoed messages apparently didn’t cause any confusion.

Although I can’t be certain, it’s likely that the MOXF is similarly sending F3 and F2 messages.

 

Davelet -

Debugging it might take a while, however, as my setup with the patchbay is so darn complicated that I have to draw diagrams all the time to work out what is talking to what (drawback of having six keyboards and 4 hardware synth modules, plus the computer … maybe time for a downsize).

Curious why it only occurs on Song 64, though!

F3 and F2 are System Common messages. As such, other MIDI gear could be responding to them. Depending on the routing, perhaps another piece of gear is sending something in reply to the Song Select 64 message, and the MOXF is receiving it but can’t deal with it.

Or not.  :-)

 

Davelet -

I still haven’t done the factory reset. Despite having backup after backup it terrifies me.

You shouldn’t have an issue with reloading a properly saved “All” file. However, my suspicion is that a factory reset won’t resolve a problem that’s related to MIDI feedback.

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Posted on: January 13, 2019 @ 07:37 PM
Stephen Kay
Avatar
Total Posts:  169
Joined  01-13-2011
status: Pro

If it is a MIDI feedback loop, then unplugging the MIDI should restore your MOXF to operation. In other words:

Connected to patchbay and computer. Select Song 64. MOXF freezes. Unplug MIDI connections. Does the MOXF return to being able to select other songs/modes?

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: January 15, 2019 @ 01:10 PM
Davelet
Total Posts:  52
Joined  07-27-2017
status: Experienced

Hi Stephen

Thanks for the suggestion, which I tried tonight.

Well, you’re not going to believe this, but I can no longer get the MOXF to crash, now, when I select song 64, no matter what is plugged in and how the patchbay routing is setup! So bizarre.

Thanks anyway for your help, and to you too 5pinDIN. Let’s close it off for now and I’ll post again if the problem resurfaces and/or I manage to shed further light on it.

Thanks again!

David.

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