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Viewing topic "Multiple velocity levels: Which approach do you like?"

     
Posted on: May 10, 2018 @ 09:06 PM
dsetto
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Joined  01-24-2014
status: Enthusiast

Hey all.

When building a sound (involving loading samples into Flash RAM) that’s got multiple velocity levels there are two fundamental starting ways to do it.

Approach 1. 1 waveform per velocity layer. Multiple waveforms.
Approach 2. 1 waveform with multiple velocity layers. Resulting in fewer waveforms.

Approach 1:
Pros. Greater control when at keyboard.
Simpler to edit & craft for a beginner; as each waveform is WYSIWYG.
Cons, uses more elements.

Approach 2:
opposite of those above.
Pros: can results in lots of velocity levels.

For oscillator swapping, I can see each approach having its benefit. ... And surely, one’s goals would dictate how you organize this. Thing is, I’m basically still a beginner with this stuff.

Thoughts? (Thanks in advance.)

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Posted on: May 11, 2018 @ 04:52 AM
5pinDIN
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Joined  09-16-2010
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Your pros and cons for those two approaches are certainly valid.

Another consideration is that flash modules have certain limitations. Per flash module (regardless if it’s 512MB, 1GB, or 2GB), the maximum number of Waveforms is 2048, Samples 8192. Should either of those limits be reached the module will be “full”, even if the MB/GB capacity hasn’t been exceeded. Doing the math, 8192/2048 = 4, implying that on average Yamaha anticipated four Samples per Waveform. While 2048 and/or 8192 might seem hard to reach, sampling for a sufficient number of keys and velocities, in stereo (two samples per KeyBank), can quickly add up.

Commercial creators of sample libraries have to take those limitations into account. If you’re sampling for your own use, and the number of “instruments” created is minimal, the limits might not have as much potential impact.

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Posted on: May 11, 2018 @ 08:34 AM
dsetto
Total Posts:  402
Joined  01-24-2014
status: Enthusiast

That’s a welcome refresher on those important limits. I’ve been ignoring those as I prep to load a flash card. I’m gonna check on that.

I suppose one of your points was waveform/sample limits may also influence how to organize your velocity levels.

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Posted on: May 11, 2018 @ 08:58 AM
5pinDIN
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dsetto - 11 May 2018 08:34 AM

[...] I suppose one of your points was waveform/sample limits may also influence how to organize your velocity levels.

Yes, those limits could be a determining factor.

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Posted on: May 12, 2018 @ 02:19 AM
dsetto
Total Posts:  402
Joined  01-24-2014
status: Enthusiast

If a keybank is in a waveform saved onto the Flash, could that very keybank, or its resident sample, be accessed by a different waveform without it having to be saved entirely again into Flash as part of the 2nd waveform?

I am certain this violates one of the principles Laws of Motif and cannot be done. It’s a case of wishful thinking.

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Posted on: May 12, 2018 @ 04:01 AM
5pinDIN
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dsetto - 12 May 2018 02:19 AM

If a keybank is in a waveform saved onto the Flash, could that very keybank, or its resident sample, be accessed by a different waveform without it having to be saved entirely again into Flash as part of the 2nd waveform?

I am certain this violates one of the principles Laws of Motif and cannot be done. It’s a case of wishful thinking.

I presume that your purpose would be to save memory space by just pointing to the Keybank, rather than copying it. Unfortunately, as you anticipated, that can’t be done.

If the goal was only to not duplicate effort, using Integrated Sampling Jobs a Waveform can be copied from a flash module to User SDRAM, and any Keybank(s) can be copied to another Waveform. That Waveform could then be copied back to a flash module. However, that would use additional memory.

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Posted on: May 12, 2018 @ 06:54 AM
dsetto
Total Posts:  402
Joined  01-24-2014
status: Enthusiast

Thanks. Yes, my motivation was for saving space, while organizing the same set of keybanks in those 2 different waveform approaches.

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Posted on: May 12, 2018 @ 07:07 AM
dsetto
Total Posts:  402
Joined  01-24-2014
status: Enthusiast

When a sample (in a keybank in a Waveform) is in User SDRAM, Integrated Sampler can modify many of its attributes. These include the sample’s: key range,velocity level, start/end/loop points, reverse, loop/one-shot, pan & tuning.

Can those be changed to samples (assigned to keybanks in waveforms) which reside on the Flash Memory Card?

I’ve tried to find the doorways to do it. Ya’ know, get to what I want to edit, then henpecking at hard & soft buttons.

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Posted on: May 12, 2018 @ 08:29 AM
5pinDIN
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A sample that resides on a flash module can indeed be brought into Integrated Sampling, edited, and then returned to its original location on the module. Here’s how…
Press [INTEGRATED SAMPLING]
Press [JOB]
Press [F3](Other)
Select 04: Copy from Flash Memory, press [ENTER], [YES]
Select the Waveform, and place a check mark at “Delete Original”  *
Press [ENTER], [YES]
Press [INTEGRATED SAMPLING]
Select the Waveform (might already be selected)
Select (highlight) the desired Keybank
Press [EDIT]
Make changes to the sample as wanted.  **
Press [ENTER], [YES]
Press [EXIT]
Press [JOB]
Select 03: Copy to Flash Memory, press [ENTER], [YES]

* Checking “Delete Original” ensures that once the sample is edited, it will be copied back to its original location (Waveform number) on the flash module. That way anything using the Waveform can find the edited version. If you don’t check “Delete Original” the unedited Waveform will remain where it was, and the edited version will be copied to the next (lowest numbered) location available.

** A USB ASCII keyboard can be helpful.

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