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Viewing topic "TOTAL NEWBIE NEEDS HELP"

     
Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 02:56 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer

Hi all!

Right off the bat I’m going to sound stupid. Please forgive me. I’m sure many of you will wish I’d leave y’all alone but I’m still gonna try to get help.

First off, I’m a drummer and can’t play piano. Well, I can’t play in the classic sense. I play, but it’s all plinking and fumbling without one tiny bit of familiarity with the keyboard. What makes it even more ridiculous is my father was a virtuoso concert pianist. Anyway, I want to learn, but that’s another matter.

So, may as well say the thing I came here to say that will most likely make most, if not all of you, vomit. I can’t understand why this has become such taboo among you people but it seems it has so I’m apologizing in advance.

Oh mommy, here goes.........

I want to play Jump. **Dives behind bushes!**

There. I said it and I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t terrified. But it’s out there now and I hope someone can swallow all that bile and help me out. It’s the only song I can play and though I hate playing it I love the way it sounds so I muscle through.

The way it sounds. Therein lies the rub. That’s why I joined this forum. A little back-story. I’m 49 and I’ve played drums for a long time. Made a living at it for years. I was also in a cover band and we tried to play Jump. Our keyboardist was great but just could not hear that the sound coming from his “Roland whatever” just didn’t have that Jump sound. We argued a lot. He didn’t have an Oberheim so how dare I bitch! Still, I thought it could be a lot better.

Now I’m in another cover band making some cash and my keyboardist also has a “Roland whatever” and I can’t stand it! So I’ve taken it upon myself to acquire a synth that, though not an Oberheim, can emulate that sound really well. My sister heard of my plight and for some reason walked into a GC and was wooed by a sales agent to buy a Yamaha moXF6. He told her she couldn’t get anything better, so she bought it for my birthday. I love her, but how dare she! Doesn’t she know I needed to hit YouTube first and see what was out there and which synth comes closest before I could make a choice? Obviously not. But gosh
was that not sweet as &@$#!!

So will the moXF do it? I’m very picky. I’ve scoured YouTube and only heard two synths come close—a Roland FA and Korg KingKorg—but I think the guy who did both videos had to do some stuff to get the sound. I only saw one moXF even try Jump but the guy actually showed in his video that he had to do a boatload of programming and tweaking. I’m not lazy but I’d like to be able to dload that beautiful growling analog Oberheim saw tooth sound and just play. Plug and play!! I’m too stupid to be able to simply read and learn enough to make the onboard patches sound right. Isn’t there a patch set I can dload right in, push a button AND VOILA!! JUMP!! There’s just gotta be. Please tell me there is.

Oh, and before you tell me that that saw tooth sound is a dime a dozen and so sickeningly ubiquitous among onboard synth patches, please understand that I’ve heard sooooooo many preloaded patches that are SUPPOSED to be that sound but just are not. All the “synth 1984” and “Jump brass” and “80’s brass” etc., are not really even close.

So here I am. I haven’t opened the box yet. Does Yamaha have a patch that is really close? Can any of you guide a newbie and help me achieve that sound? Or should I return the moXF6 and try something else?

I’m sorry this turned out rather long-winded, but...well...I REALLY want this song to sound GREAT!! Thanks so much! And please go easy.

Louie

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 03:17 PM
cmayhle
Total Posts:  3045
Joined  10-05-2011
status: Guru

You will find that sound in Vintage Keys

Owner’s Manual is attached.

Check out This Thread

File Attachments
Vintage Keys Owner's Manual.pdf  (File Size: 4229KB - Downloads: 19)
  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 04:52 PM
5pinDIN
Avatar
Total Posts:  9909
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Guru
cmayhle - 26 March 2018 03:17 PM

You will find that sound in Vintage Keys

Owner’s Manual is attached.

Check out This Thread

The MP3 demo for Vintage Keys that covers “Jump” (among several other classics) is here:
https://shop.motifator.com/index.php/downloadable/download/sample/sample_id/1005/

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 05:04 PM
philwoodmusic
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Total Posts:  908
Joined  07-01-2013
status: Guru

The voice cmayhle suggested is what I’d go with too.

Keep in mind that you’re never going to get anything to sound exactly like the record, but you can certainly get something with the right flavour doing the right kind of thing.

There is likely more to the Jump sound than just a keyboard and its programming, and that may or may not include all manner of outboard FX, dynamic processing and how hard they hit the tape during recording. 

The problem with Jump is that it is especially iconic and everyone knows it inside out.

These days I can often pick out sounds and find exactly what was used on popular virtual synths because people use all the same products and don’t stray from presets, but back in the time of Jump, who knows what they did?

Unless you were present at the recording and mix, or have access to the tapes, then it’s a mystery, sadly. (if you want total accuracy)

Prince - 1999 is another hardy perennial and can get just as deep in discussion in terms of what was used and how it was played.  Like Jump, I’ve never heard anyone get it right live, including Prince himself.

Maybe also have a listen to how Van Halen play it on recent tours, because I’d be surprised if that synth part is live and they don’t play to the original recording of it in isolation on some clips.

From having a look around you tube, I can’t find a live Van Halen version which sounds exactly right. 

That must tell us something.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 10:11 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer
philwoodmusic - 26 March 2018 05:04 PM

The voice cmayhle suggested is what I’d go with too.

Keep in mind that you’re never going to get anything to sound exactly like the record, but you can certainly get something with the right flavour doing the right kind of thing.

There is likely more to the Jump sound than just a keyboard and its programming, and that may or may not include all manner of outboard FX, dynamic processing and how hard they hit the tape during recording. 

The problem with Jump is that it is especially iconic and everyone knows it inside out.

These days I can often pick out sounds and find exactly what was used on popular virtual synths because people use all the same products and don’t stray from presets, but back in the time of Jump, who knows what they did?

Unless you were present at the recording and mix, or have access to the tapes, then it’s a mystery, sadly. (if you want total accuracy)

Prince - 1999 is another hardy perennial and can get just as deep in discussion in terms of what was used and how it was played.  Like Jump, I’ve never heard anyone get it right live, including Prince himself.

Maybe also have a listen to how Van Halen play it on recent tours, because I’d be surprised if that synth part is live and they don’t play to the original recording of it in isolation on some clips.

From having a look around you tube, I can’t find a live Van Halen version which sounds exactly right. 

That must tell us something.

Thanks so much for your comprehensive reply. Something to think about for sure. And you are absolutely right about there being more to the sound than merely the patch in a synth. Eddie even overdrove the Oberheim through his Marshal rig to get a grittier sound. I’m an Eddie and Alex fanatic and I used to read hundreds of articles on the boys and their techniques. You hit it spot-on—there’s a lot more to that sound than meets the earz.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 10:12 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer
cmayhle - 26 March 2018 03:17 PM

You will find that sound in Vintage Keys

Owner’s Manual is attached.

Check out This Thread

Thanks so much! Will look into that!

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 26, 2018 @ 10:13 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer
5pinDIN - 26 March 2018 04:52 PM
cmayhle - 26 March 2018 03:17 PM

You will find that sound in Vintage Keys

Owner’s Manual is attached.

Check out This Thread

The MP3 demo for Vintage Keys that covers “Jump” (among several other classics) is here:
https://shop.motifator.com/index.php/downloadable/download/sample/sample_id/1005/

Great! Thanks!!

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 09:40 AM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer

Hi! Just found “80’s Pop and Rock sound set” from playkeyz.com. To me it sounds better than the Vintage Keys 80’s package. Anyone have any opinions they wouldn’t mind sharing?  I don’t want to step on any toes – am I allowed to bring up third-party sellers on this site? Please forgive me but I’m clueless.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 10:32 AM
5pinDIN
Avatar
Total Posts:  9909
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Guru
Flood - 27 March 2018 09:40 AM

Hi! Just found “80’s Pop and Rock sound set” from playkeyz.com. To me it sounds better than the Vintage Keys 80’s package. Anyone have any opinions they wouldn’t mind sharing?  I don’t want to step on any toes – am I allowed to bring up third-party sellers on this site? Please forgive me but I’m clueless.

I won’t get into a discussion of which “sounds better”, since personal taste and other variables can influence that.

Motifator used to sell the 80s Pop/Rock Soundset(s), but no longer does. I don’t know why. However, although they’re not available here, I can’t imagine that the topic would be off limits.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 11:12 AM
cmayhle
Total Posts:  3045
Joined  10-05-2011
status: Guru
Flood - 27 March 2018 09:40 AM

Hi! Just found “80’s Pop and Rock sound set” from playkeyz.com. To me it sounds better than the Vintage Keys 80’s package. Anyone have any opinions they wouldn’t mind sharing?  I don’t want to step on any toes – am I allowed to bring up third-party sellers on this site? Please forgive me but I’m clueless.

I say whatever floats your boat.  Or in this case, whatever makes you “Jump”!

Per 3rd party sellers:  We Motifators like to recommend purchasing in the local Motifator Shop whenever possible (that’s what makes this forum work), but many items that interest folks here are not available there.

As far as I know, other than that consideration, there is not a problem referencing items available from other sellers.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 12:03 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer

Thanks so much, guys! You cleared that up!

When I finally choose a sound set, can someone tell me if I’ll be able to download them onto my moXF6 and instantly be able to call up the patches and play? Will they instantly sound like the demo files I’ve heard? Or will I still have to do “stuff?”

I really hope I’ll be able to dload the files and then have fun playing them without work. Like I mentioned initially—will they be plug and play or will I be disappointed in how much I’ll still have to do? This thing isn’t a workstation for me. More like a jukebox, but one you have to actually play! HA!

Thanks!

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 12:15 PM
cmayhle
Total Posts:  3045
Joined  10-05-2011
status: Guru
Flood - 27 March 2018 12:03 PM

Thanks so much, guys! You cleared that up!

When I finally choose a sound set, can someone tell me if I’ll be able to download them onto my moXF6 and instantly be able to call up the patches and play? Will they instantly sound like the demo files I’ve heard? Or will I still have to do “stuff?”

I really hope I’ll be able to dload the files and then have fun playing them without work. Like I mentioned initially—will they be plug and play or will I be disappointed in how much I’ll still have to do? This thing isn’t a workstation for me. More like a jukebox, but one you have to actually play! HA!

Thanks!

In case you aren’t aware, the (2) 3rd Party Libraries being discussed both use the internal native MOXF samples...they are simply a set of sound-designer “tweaks”, to the very deep palate of parameters available for editing.  Those tweaks are what you are actually paying for!

With that in mind, yes, once installed the VOICES that are provided will be instantly set up to sound precisely as the demo versions.  The one caveat is that you may have Master or System effects (which are obviously external to the VOICE itself) set up in such a way that it will “color” the VOICE differently than the sample heard online.

Keep in mind that you will be able to do “stuff” to the new VOICES yourself, should you desire.  If so, you can either overwrite the purchased VOICE itself (don’t worry, you will still have the original available in the file you bought), or you can STORE your Edited version to a new USER location, and maintain both versions in the machine at the same time.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 27, 2018 @ 11:17 PM
Flood
Total Posts:  7
Joined  03-26-2018
status: Newcomer
cmayhle - 27 March 2018 12:15 PM
Flood - 27 March 2018 12:03 PM

Thanks so much, guys! You cleared that up!

When I finally choose a sound set, can someone tell me if I’ll be able to download them onto my moXF6 and instantly be able to call up the patches and play? Will they instantly sound like the demo files I’ve heard? Or will I still have to do “stuff?”

I really hope I’ll be able to dload the files and then have fun playing them without work. Like I mentioned initially—will they be plug and play or will I be disappointed in how much I’ll still have to do? This thing isn’t a workstation for me. More like a jukebox, but one you have to actually play! HA!

Thanks!

In case you aren’t aware, the (2) 3rd Party Libraries being discussed both use the internal native MOXF samples...they are simply a set of sound-designer “tweaks”, to the very deep palate of parameters available for editing.  Those tweaks are what you are actually paying for!

With that in mind, yes, once installed the VOICES that are provided will be instantly set up to sound precisely as the demo versions.  The one caveat is that you may have Master or System effects (which are obviously external to the VOICE itself) set up in such a way that it will “color” the VOICE differently than the sample heard online.

Keep in mind that you will be able to do “stuff” to the new VOICES yourself, should you desire.  If so, you can either overwrite the purchased VOICE itself (don’t worry, you will still have the original available in the file you bought), or you can STORE your Edited version to a new USER location, and maintain both versions in the machine at the same time.

Thanks very much! I don’t think I understand very well but you’ve definitely made the process more clear.
I’ll most likely have many questions once I’ve received the sound set and tried to input and implement them.

  [ Ignore ]  


 
     


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