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Viewing topic "Master Mode - change only performance on external keyboard"

   
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Posted on: March 07, 2018 @ 11:12 AM
kayrd
Total Posts:  135
Joined  06-21-2005
status: Pro

I´ve connected an XF7 and MOXF8 with MIDI cables.
I´m using my XF7 to change voices and perfomances on my MOXF8 with the help of Master Mode, zones and MSB/LSB and program change.
It works well. When pressing the next master on XF7, I´m changing voices on my MOXF8. Perfect.

As you might guess, I´m using both keyboards when playing live, so I only want Master Mode to change voices/performances and NOT play the sounds on my MOXF8 from my XF7.

I know it´s not a big thing. I can just use both keyboards separate and change voices by pressing INC/DEC-buttons for instance, but live a want to use as little time changing sounds as I can, and live performance-focus be used more with the music and audience, and not to much time messing around with the keyboards.

Hopefully I´ve explained myself well :-)

kayrd

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Posted on: March 07, 2018 @ 11:54 AM
5pinDIN
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kayrd - 07 March 2018 11:12 AM

[...] I´m using my XF7 to change voices and perfomances on my MOXF8 with the help of Master Mode, zones and MSB/LSB and program change.
It works well. When pressing the next master on XF7, I´m changing voices on my MOXF8. Perfect.

As you might guess, I´m using both keyboards when playing live, so I only want Master Mode to change voices/performances and NOT play the sounds on my MOXF8 from my XF7. [...]

For the Zone that selects the MOXF Voice, set the Note Limits so Note-On events won’t be triggered.

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Posted on: March 07, 2018 @ 11:07 PM
kayrd
Total Posts:  135
Joined  06-21-2005
status: Pro

Of course… I should have figured out that myself.
Thanx 5pinDIN!

kayrd

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Posted on: March 08, 2018 @ 11:08 AM
5pinDIN
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kayrd - 07 March 2018 11:07 PM

Of course… I should have figured out that myself.
Thanx 5pinDIN!

kayrd

You’re welcome! I’m happy to have provided a little nudge in the right direction.

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Posted on: March 08, 2018 @ 11:09 AM
kayrd
Total Posts:  135
Joined  06-21-2005
status: Pro

My first issue is resolved.

Now I can´t change between voices and performances on the MOXF with MSB LSB and program change on Master mode on the XF7.
When I´ve changed manually to voice mode on my MOXF I can change from program changes on my XF7.

I reckon this is possible?? Say I´m playing a voice on my MOXF8 on my first song, but on the next song I´ve made a performance.

I seem to have problems with changing from mode to mode on the MOXF8 with Master Mode on my XF7…

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Posted on: March 08, 2018 @ 11:56 AM
5pinDIN
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kayrd - 08 March 2018 11:09 AM

My first issue is resolved.

OK.

 

kayrd - 08 March 2018 11:09 AM

Now I can´t change between voices and performances on the MOXF with MSB LSB and program change on Master mode on the XF7.
When I´ve changed manually to voice mode on my MOXF I can change from program changes on my XF7.

I reckon this is possible?? Say I´m playing a voice on my MOXF8 on my first song, but on the next song I´ve made a performance.

I seem to have problems with changing from mode to mode on the MOXF8 with Master Mode on my XF7…

Switching modes requires sending a MIDI SysEx Parameter Change message.

See page 123 of the MOXF Data List (http://download.yamaha.com/file/60483), beneath the Bank Select table.

To create a Mode change message, see page 121, (3-6-3-1) NATIVE PARAMETER CHANGE, MODE CHANGE, for the general form of the message, and page 125, MIDI PARAMETER CHANGE TABLE (MODE CHANGE), for the address and data bytes.

That results in a message of this form…
F0 43 10 7F 1C 00 0A 00 01 mm F7
...where “mm” is:
00 Voice mode
01 Performance mode
02 Song (Mixing) mode
03 Pattern (Mixing) mode
04 Master mode

The message to select Performance mode would therefore be…
F0 43 10 7F 1C 00 0A 00 01 01 F7

The XF could send such a message via a sequence. However, this approach is probably more complicated than you might want to deal with.

An alternative to switching from Voices to Performances could be to keep the MOXF in Performance mode. In place of the Voices, you could set up Performances having just a single Part, the one Voice you would otherwise play in Voice mode.

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Posted on: March 15, 2018 @ 05:20 AM
motidave
Total Posts:  426
Joined  10-03-2010
status: Enthusiast

I don’t send midi changes from one board to another, as i perform single board.  But I do what 5pin suggested - I do all in Performance mode, if I need just one Voice, I put that one voice in a Performance.  That way I can arrange all Performances to the Set list and just stay in Perf mode through the gig and sequence thru 1, 2, 3, .. much easier on a dark stage for me.

Another option is you can assign each V or P you need to a Master mode location - Voice 1 = MM location 1, Perf 1.= MM location 2, etc.  Then you could just stay in master mode throughout the gig and send the program changes without a mode change.

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Posted on: October 09, 2018 @ 07:08 AM
EricMonroe
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This is a good thread to post my question.

I am trying to change songs from another device. Does the XF accept program changes like it does in performance mode. I don’t mind manually setting it in song mode for the evening. I just want to change songs.

Thanks Eric

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Posted on: October 09, 2018 @ 09:05 AM
5pinDIN
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EricMonroe - 09 October 2018 07:08 AM

This is a good thread to post my question.

While your question isn’t really related to the topic of this thread…

 

EricMonroe -

I am trying to change songs from another device. Does the XF accept program changes like it does in performance mode. I don’t mind manually setting it in song mode for the evening. I just want to change songs.

Thanks Eric

...I’ll reply here, anyway.  :-)

While in Song mode, a Program Change message won’t do what you want. In order to change Songs (or Patterns), the XF needs to receive a Song Select message.

See my first post in this thread:
http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/479764

If the transmitting device can’t readily send Song Select, a MIDI Event Processor could be used to convert a different message into the correct one.

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Posted on: October 11, 2018 @ 03:03 PM
EricMonroe
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Okay! Thank you!

I am using mainstage and I can send a midi file. I have experience with programming however I have never sent a midi file before. On a whim I tried sending F3 10 to change the song however I assume I may need some code before and after that to complete this midi message.

What would be a good thread to continue this conversation in?

Again thank you so much for your valuable help to all of us here in the Forum., sincerely Eric

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Posted on: October 11, 2018 @ 04:39 PM
5pinDIN
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EricMonroe - 11 October 2018 03:03 PM

Okay! Thank you!

I am using mainstage and I can send a midi file. I have experience with programming however I have never sent a midi file before. On a whim I tried sending F3 10 to change the song however I assume I may need some code before and after that to complete this midi message.

What would be a good thread to continue this conversation in?

Again thank you so much for your valuable help to all of us here in the Forum., sincerely Eric

You’re welcome. Since we started here, let’s continue…

Song Select is a MIDI System Common message, not a file. An F3 10 message is complete as is, and will select Song 17 or Pattern 17, depending on which mode the XF is in. Hopefully you can get MainStage to send such a Song Select message.

I don’t use MainStage, but I found this…
https://support.apple.com/kb/PH13578?locale=en_US
...which might be helpful. If not, let us know and perhaps a member who uses MainStage will post.

Otherwise, Apple apparently has a forum for Mainstage where you might be able to get some assistance:
https://discussions.apple.com/community/professional_applications/mainstage

Good luck in getting this resolved.

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Posted on: October 12, 2018 @ 04:49 AM
EricMonroe
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Cool.

I don’t see an option in mainstage to send a MIDI System Common message. I do have an option for a midi file.

Can I send this message via the midi file?

Thank you! :)

Eric

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Posted on: October 12, 2018 @ 05:45 AM
5pinDIN
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I have doubts that a Song Select message will qualify as a MIDI file in MainStage.
I found this about trying to send Song Select with Logic…
https://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117796
...and the suggestion was made to use MidiPipe to convert a CC message into Song Select (Mac only).

Here are links to MidiPipe information:
http://www.google.com/search?q=midipipe

Other programs could be used for Windows.

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Posted on: October 12, 2018 @ 11:16 AM
EricMonroe
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Gotcha, I am going to try to download midipipe and keep my fingers crossed.

On another note, during my search for a solution here, I stumbled on an article that explains what you have already taught me about using mixing mode in a live application… you probably are aware of this link, however I thought I would share it in case you could use it to explain to newbie like me about the glory of the mixing mode in live application.

https://www.yamahasynth.com/motifxf-category/using-a-mixing-program-for-quick-access-to-multiple-sounds-in-a-live-setup

thanks, Eric

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Posted on: October 12, 2018 @ 12:34 PM
EricMonroe
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Ok, midipipe is getting warm....

See attachment. Looks like i have setup the F3 and then a random song number. Mainstage sees the ‘input’ of midipipe… but its not changing songs.

I have tried changing midi through… etc… Ideas?

How should my XF be setup… anything there that could block it? (it receives everything else ok)

I wish i could isolate midipipe… and trigger the event from there… as a test, but i see no way… and there is NO documentation lol

thanks, Eric

Image Attachments
Screen Shot 2018-10-12 at 1.29.40 PM.png
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Posted on: October 12, 2018 @ 01:58 PM
5pinDIN
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EricMonroe - 12 October 2018 12:34 PM

Ok, midipipe is getting warm....

See attachment. Looks like i have setup the F3 and then a random song number. Mainstage sees the ‘input’ of midipipe… but its not changing songs.

I have tried changing midi through… etc… Ideas?

If I’m understanding what you’re doing, you seem to have things kind of backwards. You want MainStage to send a CC message (a high numbered one that won’t cause other grief) to MidiPipe, and have MidiPipe convert that to a Song Select (F3 nn) message to be sent to the XF.

 

EricMonroe -

How should my XF be setup… anything there that could block it? (it receives everything else ok)

I’ve used MIDI-OX (a Windows app) to test sending Song Select messages to my XF, and it works quite well in Song and Pattern modes. It requires nothing special, the default setup for the XF is fine.

 

EricMonroe -

I wish i could isolate midipipe… and trigger the event from there… as a test, but i see no way… and there is NO documentation lol

thanks, Eric

If you click on the Google search link I provided, the first hit is a description of MidiPipe usage. The third hit is a YouTube video that claims to show how to convert CC data.

This Mac app…
https://www.snoize.com/SysExLibrarian/
...might be able to send Song Select to the XF as a test.

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