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Viewing topic "Assignable Function Buttons & Master Mode"

     
Posted on: February 10, 2018 @ 01:50 PM
RichS
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I’m setting up my XF6 as a controller for a polychain of Moog Slim Phattys.  This effectively turns a bunch of Slims into a polyphonic synthesizer where the number of voices = the number of Slims.  It’s quite awesome.

I’m using Master Mode to accomplish this and so far everything is working out well.  I’m only using External sends and my Keyboard Transmit Channel is set to OFF.

I’ve set the Cutoff and Res knobs to control these functions on the Moog plus I’ve set the ADSR buttons and sliders to control the filter and amp functions (respectively).  I’ve also set up Slider #8 to control Portamento Time.

So far so good.....

I’d like to set the Assignable Function 2 button to turn Portamento on and off.  I’ve set up Utility->Control->Control ->A. Function 2 Control No. to 65 (Portamento Switch).  If the button is in Latch Mode it will turn the Moog’s Glide function on but not off.  If set to Momentary Mode it will only keep Glide on while the button is depressed.

The Moog documentation states that for Glide CC#65 with a value of 0 will switch glide off and a value of 64 will switch it on but I can’t find a way of having the button send a value with the CC.

Is it possible to do this?  Am I going about it all wrong?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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Posted on: February 10, 2018 @ 05:23 PM
5pinDIN
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RichS - 10 February 2018 01:50 PM

[...] I’d like to set the Assignable Function 2 button to turn Portamento on and off.  I’ve set up Utility->Control->Control ->A. Function 2 Control No. to 65 (Portamento Switch).  If the button is in Latch Mode it will turn the Moog’s Glide function on but not off.  If set to Momentary Mode it will only keep Glide on while the button is depressed.

The Moog documentation states that for Glide CC#65 with a value of 0 will switch glide off and a value of 64 will switch it on but I can’t find a way of having the button send a value with the CC.

Is it possible to do this?  Am I going about it all wrong?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

When an AF button is turned “on” (LED lit - either latched or momentarily being held down) it sends the CC# that was set, with value 127. When the button is turned “off” (LED unlit - unlatched or released), it sends the CC# with value 0 (zero). Those values can’t be changed.

MIDI devices commonly respond to switch values 0~63 as “off”, and values 64~127 as “on”.

Are you saying that the Moogs work as expected if the XF’s AF is set for Momentary operation, but not for Latched?

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Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 06:27 AM
RichS
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5pinDIN - 10 February 2018 05:23 PM

MIDI devices commonly respond to switch values 0~63 as “off”, and values 64~127 as “on”.

Are you saying that the Moogs work as expected if the XF’s AF is set for Momentary operation, but not for Latched?

Thanks for the reply 5pinDIN.  Yes, this is the way the Moogs function and this seems to be what is happening.

For some reason the LEDs on Assignable Function buttons 1 & 2 don’t light up when I’m in Master Mode (using Zones).  I’m using an initialized preset as the Voice in Master Mode although I don’t really need a Voice as my goal is to only control external devices.  I’m not sure if that info is helpful I just thought I’d mention it.

When I push the buttons though the MIDI receive indicators on the Slim Phattys indicate that they are receiving MIDI data.  My next plan it to connect the Motif’s MIDI OUT to a MIDI analyzer so I can determine what exactly is coming down the pipeline.

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Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 07:08 AM
5pinDIN
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RichS - 11 February 2018 06:27 AM

Thanks for the reply 5pinDIN.

You’re welcome.

 

RichS -

Yes, this is the way the Moogs function and this seems to be what is happening.

For some reason the LEDs on Assignable Function buttons 1 & 2 don’t light up when I’m in Master Mode (using Zones).  I’m using an initialized preset as the Voice in Master Mode although I don’t really need a Voice as my goal is to only control external devices.  I’m not sure if that info is helpful I just thought I’d mention it.

Definitely helpful.

With a zoned Master, the default is for the Transmit Switch for each zone to be turned off for three controllers - the Ribbon, and the two AF buttons. The LEDs not lighting would appear to indicate that you didn’t turn AF transmission on.

With your zoned Master selected…
Press [EDIT]
Press [1]-[8] to select a Zone
Press [F3](Tx Switch)
Press [SF2](Control)
Turn on A Function 1 and/or A Function 2 (indicated by check mark) as desired for each active Zone.

See the XF Reference Manual, page 216, MIDI Transmit switch for the Other Messages.

Hopefully that will resolve the problem.
 

RichS -

When I push the buttons though the MIDI receive indicators on the Slim Phattys indicate that they are receiving MIDI data.  My next plan it to connect the Motif’s MIDI OUT to a MIDI analyzer so I can determine what exactly is coming down the pipeline.

It’s a good idea to use a MIDI utility to monitor the actual data being sent. For Windows, I use MIDI-OX. There are also utilities for Macs to provide the information.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 08:14 AM
RichS
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I double-checked and the AF buttons are set to transmit on all 8 zones.

When I connected the output to my MIDI monitor it indicates that CC65 is being sent with a value of 127 (x 8 as all 8 zones seem to be transmitting the same thing). 

If I switch the AF2 button to Momentary mode the MIDI monitor indicates that a value of 127 is received while the button is depressed and a value of 0 is received when it is released.

The LED still does not illuminate.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 09:09 AM
5pinDIN
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RichS - 11 February 2018 08:14 AM

I double-checked and the AF buttons are set to transmit on all 8 zones.

When I connected the output to my MIDI monitor it indicates that CC65 is being sent with a value of 127 (x 8 as all 8 zones seem to be transmitting the same thing). 

If I switch the AF2 button to Momentary mode the MIDI monitor indicates that a value of 127 is received while the button is depressed and a value of 0 is received when it is released.

The LED still does not illuminate.

With my own XF…
With the AF set to Latch, toggling the button causes the value to switch between 127 and 0. The LED lights, or not, to indicate the on/off state.

If you’re willing to post an “All"/X3A file without samples (Zipped) with a Master that behaves as you’ve described, I’d like to see what’s happening. However, before doing that, “just in case"…
Which version of the OS is installed in your XF?
Press [UTILITY] to enter the Utility mode.
Press [UTILITY], [ ^ ](Cursor Up) and [F1] buttons simultaneously.
Read the firmware version, ignoring the second decimal point and anything after it. Version 1.50 is the most recent.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 10:02 AM
RichS
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Firmware version 1.50.4

I’m attaching an ALL file.  You’ll see 100 files that are all similar as I’ve set them up so that stepping through all the Motif’s program selections will actually switch to the appropriate Slim Phatty preset.  Again, not sure if this was the best way to do things but…

The first Master Mode is the one I’ve been working with mainly in trying to get this working so it’s probably the best to look at.

Thanks again so much for your time and effort!!

File Attachments
RichS.n3.X3A.zip  (File Size: 549KB - Downloads: 30)
  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 03:18 PM
5pinDIN
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RichS - 11 February 2018 10:02 AM

Firmware version 1.50.4

OK, that’s the most recent.

 

RichS -

I’m attaching an ALL file. [...]

Thanks, got it.

 

RichS -

Thanks again so much for your time and effort!!

No problem.

Now that I have your file loaded, I’m able to more fully reply to your previous message, below.
 
====================================
 

RichS - 11 February 2018 08:14 AM

I double-checked and the AF buttons are set to transmit on all 8 zones.

When I connected the output to my MIDI monitor it indicates that CC65 is being sent with a value of 127 (x 8 as all 8 zones seem to be transmitting the same thing).

All Zones are transmitting the same thing because “the AF buttons are set to transmit on all 8 zones”, the Ext (external) Switch is turned on for all Zones, and all the Zones are set to transmit on MIDI channel 1. Of course, there’s no reason to have that redundancy. If multiple external devices are connected, then they should probably be addressed on separate channels. Otherwise, there’s no need to be transmitting the same data multiple times.

 

RichS -

If I switch the AF2 button to Momentary mode the MIDI monitor indicates that a value of 127 is received while the button is depressed and a value of 0 is received when it is released.

The LED still does not illuminate.

Transmit is only turned on for the External Switches in your Master. Because the Int (Internal) Switch isn’t on for any of the Zones, the XF itself isn’t seeing AF actuation. Pressing an AF button under those conditions will generate the CC# and value 127 externally, but since the XF doesn’t see the operation, the button won’t latch (when set to do that), the LED won’t light, and when the button is released the CC# and value 0 won’t be sent.

Simple solution:
Turn on the Transmit Int Switch.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 11, 2018 @ 04:49 PM
RichS
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THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

As usual your solution worked perfectly! 

Thank you as well for the explanation.  I understand a bit better how this incredibly versatile machine works.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: February 12, 2018 @ 05:00 AM
5pinDIN
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RichS - 11 February 2018 04:49 PM

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

As usual your solution worked perfectly!

You’re welcome! I’m glad that resolved things. Thanks for providing enough information so that I could determine what the problem was.

 

RichS -

Thank you as well for the explanation.  I understand a bit better how this incredibly versatile machine works.

Unfortunately, with versatility typically comes complexity.

Fortunately, there’s often a way to convince a Motif to do what you want anyway.  :-)

  [ Ignore ]  


 
     


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