I see that the MOXF gives you 384 user slots for your own sounds.  I’ve also found additional sound banks that you can download.  So, using the librarian sound editor, can one add these external sounds to these user sound slots?  Or do you have to the 1 gig card?  Any info appreciated, thanks.

Here is the short answer:

If the 3rd Part Library uses ONLY the native internal samples of the machine (many do), then the VOICES can be STORED with no need for the Flash Module.

If the 3rd Part Library uses any NEW (non-native) sample data (many do),then the NEW sample data must be LOADED to the optional Flash Module to be utilized in support of those VOICES that require said samples.

In either event, VOICE, PERFORMANCE, SONG, PATTERN, and MASTER setups are ALWAYS LOADED into the BANKS reserved for each type of such USER data. 

Optional Flash Modules are ONLY for sample data.

Thanks cmayhle.  I wonder, are the sounds that are offered by Yamaha as additional downloadable sounds based on native internal samples of the machine?

cmayhle - 17 April 2017 11:33 PM

Here is the short answer:

If the 3rd Part Library uses ONLY the native internal samples of the machine (many do), then the VOICES can be STORED with no need for the Flash Module.

If the 3rd Part Library uses any NEW (non-native) sample data (many do),then the NEW sample data must be LOADED to the optional Flash Module to be utilized in support of those VOICES that require said samples.

In either event, VOICE, PERFORMANCE, SONG, PATTERN, and MASTER setups are ALWAYS LOADED into the BANKS reserved for each type of such USER data. 

Optional Flash Modules are ONLY for sample data.

tradivoro - 18 April 2017 03:30 PM

Thanks cmayhle.  I wonder, are the sounds that are offered by Yamaha as additional downloadable sounds based on native internal samples of the machine?

cmayhle - 17 April 2017 11:33 PM

Here is the short answer:

If the 3rd Part Library uses ONLY the native internal samples of the machine (many do), then the VOICES can be STORED with no need for the Flash Module.

If the 3rd Part Library uses any NEW (non-native) sample data (many do),then the NEW sample data must be LOADED to the optional Flash Module to be utilized in support of those VOICES that require said samples.

In either event, VOICE, PERFORMANCE, SONG, PATTERN, and MASTER setups are ALWAYS LOADED into the BANKS reserved for each type of such USER data. 

Optional Flash Modules are ONLY for sample data.

Short answer is it could be either.  Most YAMAHA downloads I’ve seen include new waveforns (samples), such as Inspiration in a Flash etc.  They may have downloads that only utilize the preset (internal memory) waveforms.

If you have the file, the size of the file will give you a clue.  A file that has no new waveforms (samples) will be small, on the order of less than 10 kBytes.  A file which includes samples will usually be 100kByte or more.

If you are already seeking and exploring external libraries, you are going to want to get a flash board.  Yamaha’s largest board is 1M, but there is a Mutec flash board that has double the size.  Both can only accommodate the same number of actual waveforms, as there’s a max limit of what a MOXF can address (don’t remember the count, its something around/over 1000).  But if samples are large, and sometimes they are, the larger board is the way to go in my humble opinion.  There’s only one slot for a flash board in MOXF, unlike Motif XF.  You can’t add other boards i or expand it later.  Jmo.

Thanks motidave, I guess I’m going to have to download this stuff and play with it in the editor/librarian and see which work and which don’t. 

Although I love the MOXF8, the only part where I think Yamaha dropped the ball is in using these dedicated internal cards to add more memory.  They could have used the equivalent of a flash card, such as the ones that are used in cameras, which you could pick up for next to nothing and they have a capacity of 10s of gigs.  Even a 16 gig card which cost around $10 to $20 dollars would have had more memory than the machine would ever need. 

But we’ll see how many of these sounds will actually work with the included sound slots.

motidave - 18 April 2017 09:59 PM

[...] If you have the file, the size of the file will give you a clue.  A file that has no new waveforms (samples) will be small, on the order of less than 10 kBytes.  A file which includes samples will usually be 100kByte or more. [...]

A MOXF “All” file (.X6A) will typically be about 2 MB if there are no Samples/Waveforms, and over that (sometimes hundreds of MB) when there are Samples/Waveforms.

 

tradivoro - 18 April 2017 11:02 PM

[...] Although I love the MOXF8, the only part where I think Yamaha dropped the ball is in using these dedicated internal cards to add more memory.  They could have used the equivalent of a flash card, such as the ones that are used in cameras, which you could pick up for next to nothing and they have a capacity of 10s of gigs.  Even a 16 gig card which cost around $10 to $20 dollars would have had more memory than the machine would ever need. [...]

The memory on the flash modules is a special type that can be read very fast. The inexpensive type that’s used in camera memory cards is much too slow for the purpose.

Thanks for the info on the .X6a.

The reason I mentioned the flash module is because this is precisely what the Roland FA-08 uses.  It boots up very fast and it stores the main sounds as well as new sounds on that same card.  And we’re talking a 4 gig card.  Now, I’m no fan of the FA-08 (as a matter of fact, it was because of the FA-08 that I bought the MOXF8, but that’s a long story).  But I did manage to work with one and pulling out the flash card was a breeze and copying sounds back on forth on it was a no brainer.  So, the flash card feature was one of the good things about it.

We’ll see how many sounds I can put into the user slots for the MOXF8 and which of the new sounds actually work without a memory card.  For now, I’m really enjoying the existing sounds.  But I’m sure that in these downloadable libraries, there are always gems.

tradivoro - 19 April 2017 10:47 AM

Thanks for the info on the .X6a.

You’re welcome.

 

The reason I mentioned the flash module is because this is precisely what the Roland FA-08 uses.  It boots up very fast and it stores the main sounds as well as new sounds on that same card.  And we’re talking a 4 gig card.  Now, I’m no fan of the FA-08 (as a matter of fact, it was because of the FA-08 that I bought the MOXF8, but that’s a long story).  But I did manage to work with one and pulling out the flash card was a breeze and copying sounds back on forth on it was a no brainer.  So, the flash card feature was one of the good things about it.

The Yamaha flash modules were developed for the Motif XF (and Tyros 4), a 2010 model - it’s based on the XS, a 2007 model, and the memory interface had to be compatible with the XS design. Yes, the FA-08 uses SDHC cards on a high speed bus. However, it’s a 2014 model and has the advantage of newer technology being available at the time of design.

Yamaha could probably have charged somewhat less for memory modules and still made a decent profit. However, Mutec appears to be the real winner, since they likely didn’t have much expense to develop their version of the modules, chip prices have come down, and yet their product isn’t that much less expensive than Yamaha’s.

Still, I like what the Motif series can do, and the pricing is what it is.

That’s what I thought, i figured it was a hand me down technology.  And you’re right, Mutec could have been a real hero here, selling the 1 gig card for like $60 or thereabouts. 

And I understand perfectly about the Motif instrument.  The benefits far outweigh the slight proprietary issues with hardware.  I’m very pleased with MOXF8.  So at some point, when I’ve exhausted the sounds that come with the machine or that I can use in user slots, I’ll probably get an extra memory card.

tradivoro - 19 April 2017 03:52 PM

That’s what I thought, i figured it was a hand me down technology.  And you’re right, Mutec could have been a real hero here, selling the 1 gig card for like $60 or thereabouts.[...]

That might be a bit optimistic.  :-)

The 1GB module requires eight 1-Gigabit chips, currently available for about $4US each in quantity, so $32US just for that. Add the other components, pc board, the 120-pin connector, some other hardware, and construction, and $60US probably doesn’t cover the manufacturing cost. I could see the Mutec FMC-06 selling for about $175US at retail (the Yamaha FL1024M typically goes for $250-300US), if Mutec wanted to own the market.

The 2-Gigabit chips are about twice the price of the 1-Gigabit ones, making the manufacturing cost of a 2GB module only about $40US more than that of the 1GB one. Retailing it at $300US would seemingly leave quite a bit of room for profit - it appears the price of a Mutec FMC-07 2GB module mostly reflects Mutec’s monopoly on that capacity module. I suppose if I were running Mutec’s marketing, I’d do the same.

Well, I was looking at it from the point of view of computer ram.  You can get a 8 gig stick for $40 - 50 bucks.  I figured a 1 gig stick with all the fixings would be less. But I’m no expert in these matters… :) In any event, it’s something to consider in the future.  For now, I’m enjoying the existing sounds.