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Viewing topic "Using User Drum Voice Patches with All Song (.X3S) Files"

     
Posted on: March 02, 2017 @ 03:30 AM
synthmax
Total Posts:  25
Joined  05-13-2012
status: Regular

Hi there everyone,

I am putting together a Duo act with with a singer.

I am using a MOTIF XF8 with Cubase LE AI Elements 8 and MOTIF XF Editor.

As most you all know, one of the (rather odd, I think) limitations of the MOTIF XF8 is that it only has 1Mb of onboard sequencer memory (which can’t be upgraded, as far as I know). So having 30 or so songs loaded in memory is not a option.

I plan to have at least three All Song (.X3S) Files prepared with 10 songs in each file. I will load the next 10 songs for the next set during each break.

The Voice memory of the MOTIF can store 32 User Drum Voices at once. When I set up the the Mixing Voices for each song I always set up a unique User Drum Voice for that song. I have been careful to ensure that each song has it’s own unique User Drum Voice patch number to ensure that the songs play with the correct Drum kit when I load the next All Song (.X3S) file in for the next 10 songs. I keep a spreadsheet to ensure that no two songs are using the same User Drum Voice patch. So I figure I only need to use All Song (.X3S) files to manage the sequencer memory on the MOTIF.

However, during rehearsals with the singer, I have found that when I load the next All Song (.X3S) file with the next 10 songs in it, some of the Drum Voices for some of the songs will be incorrect. In each case, my own User Drum Voice Patch for that song has reverted to the default factory User Drum Voice of the User Drum Voice List in that patch location.

Where am I going wrong? Do I have no choice but to save each set of songs as an .ALL (.X3A) file to get each set working reliably every time I load them in?

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 02, 2017 @ 05:53 AM
5pinDIN
Avatar
Total Posts:  9231
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Guru
synthmax - 02 March 2017 03:30 AM

Hi there everyone,

I am putting together a Duo act with with a singer.

I am using a MOTIF XF8 with Cubase LE AI Elements 8 and MOTIF XF Editor.

As most you all know, one of the (rather odd, I think) limitations of the MOTIF XF8 is that it only has 1Mb of onboard sequencer memory (which can’t be upgraded, as far as I know). So having 30 or so songs loaded in memory is not a option.

Without getting too deeply into the issue, it’s often the case that running out of sequencer memory has to do with recording unnecessary data, such as unintentional aftertouch.

 

synthmax -

I plan to have at least three All Song (.X3S) Files prepared with 10 songs in each file. I will load the next 10 songs for the next set during each break.

OK…

 

synthmax -

The Voice memory of the MOTIF can store 32 User Drum Voices at once. When I set up the the Mixing Voices for each song I always set up a unique User Drum Voice for that song.

I’m not sure what you’re doing, since Drum Voices (Kits) can’t be stored as Mixing Voices. Or did you mean that you set up Voices for the Mixing, including a Drum Voice? ("Mixing Voices” are special Voices, so that distinction isn’t just me being pedantic.)

 

synthmax -

I have been careful to ensure that each song has it’s own unique User Drum Voice patch number to ensure that the songs play with the correct Drum kit when I load the next All Song (.X3S) file in for the next 10 songs. I keep a spreadsheet to ensure that no two songs are using the same User Drum Voice patch. So I figure I only need to use All Song (.X3S) files to manage the sequencer memory on the MOTIF.

However, during rehearsals with the singer, I have found that when I load the next All Song (.X3S) file with the next 10 songs in it, some of the Drum Voices for some of the songs will be incorrect. In each case, my own User Drum Voice Patch for that song has reverted to the default factory User Drum Voice of the User Drum Voice List in that patch location.

Loading an “All Song” file should have no effect on previously stored User Drum Voices. Two things to check…
1) Make sure that you STORE your edited Drum Voice to the User location you want. Verify that it’s there.
2) Make sure that in each Song Mixing the Drum Voice pointed to is in the USER DR bank, not the PRE DR one.

 

synthmax -

Where am I going wrong? Do I have no choice but to save each set of songs as an .ALL (.X3A) file to get each set working reliably every time I load them in?

It should not be necessary to load an All/.X3A file to accomplish what you want.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 07, 2017 @ 03:29 AM
synthmax
Total Posts:  25
Joined  05-13-2012
status: Regular

Thanks for your reply 5pinDIN,

I really appreciate your help with this, as it’s led to a resolution of an important issue for me with the XF Editor and my MOTIF XF8.

5pinDIN

Without getting too deeply into the issue, it’s often the case that running out of sequencer memory has to do with recording unnecessary data, such as unintentional aftertouch.

I have been very careful to ensure there is only the bare minimum of data in the file required to play the song correctly. When I get a new MIDI file, I go through it in Cubase to make sure that any unnecessary data is removed. I still find that I can usually only fit about 16 songs in the sequencer memory at once. But that’s o.k., I can work within that.

5pinDIN

I’m not sure what you’re doing, since Drum Voices (Kits) can’t be stored as Mixing Voices. Or did you mean that you set up Voices for the Mixing, including a Drum Voice? ("Mixing Voices” are special Voices, so that distinction isn’t just me being pedantic.)

I know the difference between Preset Drum Voices and User Drum Voices and I know that User Drum voices can’t be stored as mixing voices.

5pinDIN

Loading an “All Song” file should have no effect on previously stored User Drum Voices. Two things to check…
1) Make sure that you STORE your edited Drum Voice to the User location you want. Verify that it’s there.
2) Make sure that in each Song Mixing the Drum Voice pointed to is in the USER DR bank, not the PRE DR one.

The lightbulb moment here for me was when you said to make sure that I should make sure I STORE the edited Drum Voice to the user location I want and verify it’s there. As soon as I manually STORED the edited drum voice into a user location using the MOTIF’s buttons and controls, rather than the XF Extension in Cubase, everything fell beautifully into place. Where I had gone wrong is that I thought by using “Store Voice” option in the XF Extension this would write the Drum Voice into the “Drum User” Section in Flash ROM on the MOTIF. The software creates the impression that this is happening, but I think the voice is only getting stored in the Drum Voice edit buffer, rather than than Flash ROM.

5pinDIN

It should not be necessary to load an All/.X3A file to accomplish what you want.

Agreed. This isn’t necessary.

The realisation that that Drum Voices were not being stored in Flash ROM led me to check various options and preferences in the XF Extension. Upon checking and experimenting with the options in “Data Synch” I think I’ve discovered that the reason that Drum Voices were not being stored in into the “Drum User” section in Flash ROM was because I had everything set to “off” in the “Data Synch” settings. Upon switching “Data Synch” to “Transmit” and switching “Drum User” to “on”, I now find that I can see all my saved User Drum Voices on the MOTIF and can update the ”Drum User” Section in Flash ROM on the MOTIF using the XF Extension.

This leads me to ask a few more questions:

1. What do the “Current” and “Global” switches in “Data Synch” do specifically?

2. Considering my setup and the project I am working on, what settings would you recommend for “Data Synch” in the XF Extension?

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 07, 2017 @ 05:11 AM
5pinDIN
Avatar
Total Posts:  9231
Joined  09-16-2010
status: Guru
synthmax - 07 March 2017 03:29 AM

Thanks for your reply 5pinDIN,

I really appreciate your help with this, as it’s led to a resolution of an important issue for me with the XF Editor and my MOTIF XF8.

You’re welcome - I’m glad you got that resolved.

 

synthmax -

This leads me to ask a few more questions:

1. What do the “Current” and “Global” switches in “Data Synch” do specifically?

Rather than go into detail here, I suggest that you take a look at the Manual, accessed under the Editor’s “Help” menu or by pressing F1. See page 3 and other pages linked from there. That should help with what comprises Current and Global data.

 

synthmax -

2. Considering my setup and the project I am working on, what settings would you recommend for “Data Synch” in the XF Extension?

Synch as little as possible, since obviously the more data is transferred, the longer it takes. It really depends on exactly what you’re editing - the information I referred to in the Manual should help you decide what’s appropriate. Transferring more data than necessary won’t hurt anything (other than perhaps your patience  ;-) ), as long as the direction it’s going is correct.

  [ Ignore ]  

Posted on: March 07, 2017 @ 06:40 PM
synthmax
Total Posts:  25
Joined  05-13-2012
status: Regular

OK. Thanks for your help. I should be ok now.

  [ Ignore ]  


 
     


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