I figured it out. Instead of sending 63/66/34 I have to send 64/67/34. Gives me bank 3 , program 34

pianoman58 - 26 January 2017 01:49 AM

Sending data B0 00 3E B0 20 41 C0 21 To all ports [...]

Just an observation:
One problem with MIDI, computers, and apps is that sometimes we start counting from 0(zero), and sometimes from 1.

BE(hex) = 62(decimal)
41(hex) = 65(decimal)

It seems the app is subtracting 1 from the MSB and LSB you’re entering.

Perhaps try adding 1 to both the MSB and LSB numbers,
so that B0 00 3F B0 20 42 C0 21 is sent.

EDIT: At this time of night, I’m just too slow.  :-)
I didn’t see the previous post until after I posted this.

I really can’t thank you guys enough !! Stoneb3 I think you put as much time and research into this as I did, maybe more.  5pinDIN Your knowledge is priceless. Thanks for hanging in there with me, seriously I would have given up

I was aware of the minus one plus one offset but I thought that only pertained to the program number not MSB/LSB. The Yamaha app is one less for the program but not MSB/LSB.  I had changed a setting in the Set List Maker app from 0-127 to 1-128 . So I can enter program 34 and it gives me program 34.

It is still a little puzzling to me. If the app is apparently operating 0-127 and the s90xs operates 1-128 it seems as though I should’ve had to subtract 1 not add 1. 

I will still need to learn how to change modes and particularly use master mode with this app for it to fill my needs.  So hopefully I have not imposed on you guys too much, I’ll be back.

Again, many thanks !!

pianoman58 - 26 January 2017 10:49 AM

I really can’t thank you guys enough !! Stoneb3 I think you put as much time and research into this as I did, maybe more.  5pinDIN Your knowledge is priceless. Thanks for hanging in there with me, seriously I would have given up

You’re welcome. Stoneb3 definitely put a lot of effort into this and deserves most of the thanks.

 

pianoman58 -

It is still a little puzzling to me. If the app is apparently operating 0-127 and the s90xs operates 1-128 it seems as though I should’ve had to subtract 1 not add 1.

 

pianoman58 -

I will still need to learn how to change modes and particularly use master mode with this app for it to fill my needs.[...]

SysEx for S90XS/S70XS, based on the Data List:

Mode selection…
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 00 F7 - Voice
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 01 F7 - Performance
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 04 F7 - Master
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 05 F7 - Multi
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 06 F7 - Demo

Master number (once in Master mode)…
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 00 nn F7
where nn = 00~7F, 0~127

5pinDIN - 26 January 2017 12:56 PM

SysEx for S90XS/S70XS, based on the Data List:

Thanks a lot for this 5pin, given the time it takes for me to type and compose, you likely saved me two hours.

pianoman58 - 26 January 2017 10:49 AM

I was aware of the minus one plus one offset but I thought that only pertained to the program number not MSB/LSB. The Yamaha app is one less for the program but not MSB/LSB.  I had changed a setting in the Set List Maker app from 0-127 to 1-128 . So I can enter program 34 and it gives me program 34.

I have two versions of the App, the latest updated today, and an older one that I gig with. I have not used the new one, not sure if I will or not. I’ll share some observations of the old one that may be of some use.

If I send 63/64/000 it references Performance 1 A1. Minus 1 from the actual program. This version does not offer an offset as in future releases. No big deal for me as it’s been that way for decades with various gear. As you posted previously your largest issue was resolved by adding 1 to your MSB/LSB/***, (63/66/34 to 64/67/34). By using the offset provided are you now able to send 63/66/34 without issue?  I realize this likely won’t matter so much on your end as you’ll probably be all SysEx. But if there’s an issue with the App, attention should be brought to it.

In the blank Hex Field of the Midi Preset I first enter the Mode Change Command. Below that on a separate line I enter the Program Change. Both as kindly described by 5pinDIN. When I send the command the Mode changes and a second tap commands the Program Change. Once I’m in that Mode only one tap is required to change programs. I’m not sure of its use but the latest version has an option to order and delay the messages, it’s located below Send Midi Presets Together in Audio>Midi of the Settings Menu. This may or may not provide a one tap action for sending both messages sequentially. I’ve read of it, I just can’t recall for sure.

In lieu of typing SysEx messages for hours on end you can utilize the Copy Midi Preset function and edit as you go to save time.

You will master this in no time, I’m glad you’ve stuck with it. You’re welcome in regard to your thanks and I’m glad to have helped. Please let us know of your progress.

Thanks again to 5pin for his wisdom and skill.

Stone

Thanks, Stone. I’m glad to help when I can.

I hope pianoman58 gets things running well.

Ok I’m starting to create my master database. One more basic question before I begin. 

Each of my songs are set up in a saved PERFORMANCE.
In live gigging I use PERFORMANCE mode and MASTER mode. I only use MASTER mode for those songs that require sending PC to another keyboard and sending Note message to harmonizer devices. 

OBJECTIVE
To be able to select songs from Setlist Maker on the fly during gig and have it go to the correct MODE, BANK and PROGRAM Regardless of which mode it is currently in.  And Regardless of the order in which the songs are selected.

QUESTION
I am planning on creating my master song database and attaching the MSB/LSB PC message to each song.  Can I then come back later and add the correct Sysex command to change banks. ....OR.... do I need to use all Sysex commands and not use MSB/LSB PC at all ? (Stoneb3 I think you may have alluded to this in previous post) Thanks !

Bank Select MSB/LSB and PC messages work in Voice and Performance modes. Switching modes requires SysEx, as does selecting a Master number - both as I previously posted.

See the Bank Select table and notes below it on page 102 of the S90XS/S70XS Data List (http://download.yamaha.com/file/96370).

[

quote]author="5pinDIN" date="1485642076"]Bank Select MSB/LSB and PC messages work in Voice and Performance modes. Switching modes requires SysEx, as does selecting a Master number - both as I previously posted.

Yes I really did previously understand this. I gather from your response that if I know this then I should know the answer.

I’m asking do I need to attach the Sysex command that will change Mode, bank and program (within performance mode) to every song .  Because I may or may not be switching FROM Master Mode.  I will be changing the order of set lists so I have no way of knowing when I will need to change modes. But when I select a song I will need it to switch modes IF I am not already in that mode.

And also if I’m using Sysex commands to switch modes do I still use MSB/LSB and PC messages (within performance mode) in other words do I use them together or can/should ALL midi information be put in Sysex form.

I understand the basics of midi and the general idea of how this works but I just don’t know how to configure this. 

Thanks for helping me, and I know it’s a little frustrating for someone who has a vast knowledge of a particular subject trying to explain to someone who has limited knowledge. Thanks again !

pianoman58 - 28 January 2017 03:59 PM

5pinDIN - 28 January 2017 02:21 PM

Bank Select MSB/LSB and PC messages work in Voice and Performance modes. Switching modes requires SysEx, as does selecting a Master number - both as I previously posted.

Yes I really did previously understand this. I gather from your response that if I know this then I should know the answer.

Sorry, I didn’t mean for what I posted to be taken as “don’t you get it?”, just that it should cover the contingencies.

 

pianoman58 -

I’m asking do I need to attach the Sysex command that will change Mode, bank and program (within performance mode) to every song .  Because I may or may not be switching FROM Master Mode.  I will be changing the order of set lists so I have no way of knowing when I will need to change modes. But when I select a song I will need it to switch modes IF I am not already in that mode.

And also if I’m using Sysex commands to switch modes do I still use MSB/LSB and PC messages (within performance mode) in other words do I use them together or can/should ALL midi information be put in Sysex form.

I think the first post from stoneb3 in this thread set out the requirements (from the standpoint of a Motif) for mode selection, Master location (number) selection, and Performance Program selection pretty well. Unfortunately, I don’t use the Set List Maker app, so I can’t guide you in how to specifically set that up. However, as far as the S90XS is concerned…

Since you can’t predict when you’ll be switching modes, all selections in the app should include the SysEx for the S90XS’s mode.
In addition…
If the mode is Master, the SysEx for the Master number would also be needed. The Master itself will point to the Performance (or other type Program) location.
... or ...
If the mode is Performance (or Voice, etc.), Bank Select MSB/LSB and PC message would also be required.

Any messages that would be redundant because the S90XS is already in a particular mode or bank won’t hurt, other than minutely slowing the selection.

I hope that helps.

 

pianoman58 -

I understand the basics of midi and the general idea of how this works but I just don’t know how to configure this. 

Thanks for helping me, and I know it’s a little frustrating for someone who has a vast knowledge of a particular subject trying to explain to someone who has limited knowledge. Thanks again !

You’re welcome. Please don’t be concerned, I’m not even slightly frustrated. I realize that Yamaha’s implementation of some functions isn’t as transparent as it could have been, so I just try to make it somewhat clearer.

My suggestion is to experiment a bit, based on the above. It should soon become obvious what works and what might not.

That’s quite alright. I should be getting it at this point. I’m close. I think I got a little worn out and frustrated from my initial problem. I went back and reviewed all the information you guys have given me . I believe I understand now. So yes I should enter all of my commands in the hex code window. Mode on first line, bank and program on second line. Per Stoneb3.  Right now I’m trying to switch from voice mode to performance mode. Then I will tackle Master mode.

So I entered:

F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 01 F7
63 66 10
Also tried
F0 43 10 7F 0D 0A 00 01 01 F7
64 67 10

Should give me , Performance Mode, Bank 3, Program 10.

I get ERROR message: Device Number is Off

Do you see anything obviously wrong with this midi message ?

pianoman58 - 28 January 2017 05:53 PM

[...] I get ERROR message: Device Number is Off

Do you see anything obviously wrong with this midi message ?

The problem is likely due to a setting in the S90XS. The third byte in the SysEx messages I posted is the Device Number, and can range from 10~1F(hex), representing Device 1~16. With that third byte at “10”, the Device Number is 1.

However, the S90XS seemingly has Device Number in Utility mode set to “off”, which will cause it to reject SysEx and display an error message. The default setting is usually “1”, although “all” should work as well (as long as you don’t have multiple S90XS keyboards, trying to send different messages to each of them).

See Device No. on page 138 of the S90XS/S70XS Reference Manual (http://download.yamaha.com/file/9610).

Ok thanks for that . I set device # to ALL.  Now it does take me from Voice or Master mode to Performance mode.  However it only takes me to whatever bank and program that was previously set in Performance mode.  No change in bank or program.

pianoman58 - 28 January 2017 07:41 PM

[...] Now it does take me from Voice or Master mode to Performance mode.  However it only takes me to whatever bank and program that was previously set in Performance mode.  No change in bank or program.

You were previously able to send MSB/LSB/PC when in Performance mode, and have it change correctly. Is that currently functioning?