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Viewing topic "Mod wheel vs super knob: what are the differences?"

     
Posted on: January 30, 2016 @ 12:52 AM
nchrist
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Joined  07-10-2009
status: Enthusiast

The Yamaha Montage looks and sounds interesting. The electronic music presets seem to have an Infected Mushroom’ vibe (their ground breaking album ‘Vicious Delicious’ in 2007 I believe set this whole EDM trend by combining their signature shifting glitch effect used in psytrance along with other genres of music like Rock and hip hop). The Superknob seems to speed up lfos among other things for such presets. Now how is that different from programming the mod wheel?

I have a Motif XS which is an amazing synth but has several lackluster presets. I like to program but nice presets inspire to create better music and modify the presets as needed to our liking. The fact that we also have an 8 operator FM synth along with awm2, and massive polyphony and effects is a compliment. The lack of sampling doesn’t bother me that much (I could use soft samplers). Regarding the sequencer.. Yep I prefer soft sequencer hands down.. Hopefully there is a way to load midi file on to the onboard sequencer once workflow is complete so I don’t have to even haul a laptop around.

Korg style touchscreen and Nord lead 3 style endless rotary encoders are convenient and cool but I worry about their reliability… My Korg m3 that I bought new in 2009 that was used occasionally and carefully in a studio environment now has a touchscreen that isn’t working properly even after calibrating. And Clavia dumped their endless led rotary encoders for conventional knobs after nl3.

I can get the job done with native instruments suite, omnisphere and 16 gigs of ram but having a hardware synth is always an extra vote of confidence with respect to the workflow and reliability and generally better programmed presets.

For all I know, I’m still planning to keep my motif XS but this is the 1st Yamaha synth product after the XS that has caught my eye.

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Posted on: February 01, 2016 @ 04:14 PM
5pinDIN
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nchrist - 30 January 2016 12:52 AM

[...] The Superknob seems to speed up lfos among other things for such presets. Now how is that different from programming the mod wheel?[...]

What the Super Knob will be able to do isn’t completely obvious yet. Certainly it will morph from one sound to another.

Programming of the mod wheel on an XS/XF can also be used to transition between sounds. I’ve attached an “all voice” file with a Voice in which the MW is used to cross-fade from one sound to another.

The file is zipped. Once uncompressed, it’s an X0V, compatible with either an XS or XF. The Voice is in User1 A01. All other locations are Initialized. If anyone wants to try the Voice, I’d suggest loading it using Type “voice” (not “all voice"), and choose a User location you don’t care about.

File Attachments
MWxFade_5pinDIN.zip  (File Size: 1KB - Downloads: 112)
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Posted on: February 02, 2016 @ 08:11 AM
nchrist
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Thanks very much 5pindin! Much appreciated :)

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Posted on: February 02, 2016 @ 03:35 PM
5pinDIN
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nchrist - 02 February 2016 08:11 AM

Thanks very much 5pindin! Much appreciated :)

You’re welcome!

If interested, take a look at the Voice’s Element Amplitude levels and Controller Set Assignments to see what I did.

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Posted on: February 03, 2016 @ 08:32 AM
DavePolich
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Each part in a performance can have eight knob assignments. Each of these assignments can control multiple destinations, which can be effects parameters, envelope controls, motion sequence control, etc...almost everything can be a destination. Think of a part as the equivalent of a voice on the XF.

A performance can have up to 8 user-accessed parts (parts that can be individually selected from the front panel).

The Super Knob can control any of the assignments per part. It can be set to one of three states - left, middle, or right. The left is one value, the right is another value. The middle is between the two values.

So the Super Knob can control multiple parameters at once, for all eight parts in a performance. Some performances contain just one part, some contain eight parts. One of the
things a motion sequence part assignment can do is control the Super Knob movement itself. That’s why some of the videos show the super knob glow “fluttering”...it’s moving extremely fast between states, and not just in a cyclical manner.

This is why Montage is something you’ll never find in a software VST. There isnt a VST equivalent. It’s an extremely deep machine. The possible combinations of control to destinations number in the hundreds of thousands, at least.

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Posted on: February 03, 2016 @ 06:33 PM
motidave
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DavePolich - 03 February 2016 08:32 AM

Each part in a performance can have eight knob assignments. Each of these assignments can control multiple destinations, which can be effects parameters, envelope controls, motion sequence control, etc...almost everything can be a destination. Think of a part as the equivalent of a voice on the XF.

A performance can have up to 8 user-accessed parts (parts that can be individually selected from the front panel).

The Super Knob can control any of the assignments per part. It can be set to one of three states - left, middle, or right. The left is one value, the right is another value. The middle is between the two values.

So the Super Knob can control multiple parameters at once, for all eight parts in a performance. Some performances contain just one part, some contain eight parts. One of the
things a motion sequence part assignment can do is control the Super Knob movement itself. That’s why some of the videos show the super knob glow “fluttering”...it’s moving extremely fast between states, and not just in a cyclical manner.

This is why Montage is something you’ll never find in a software VST. There isnt a VST equivalent. It’s an extremely deep machine. The possible combinations of control to destinations number in the hundreds of thousands, at least.

Dave, when will you start developing libraries for Montage? :)

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Posted on: February 04, 2016 @ 09:20 AM
DavePolich
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First library from DCP for Montage will be Vintage Keys. Expected release first week of May.

It will be available at yamahamusicsoft.com. Not on Motifator.

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Posted on: February 04, 2016 @ 10:29 AM
papaphoenix
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Thank you Dave for this information ;)

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Posted on: February 04, 2016 @ 01:08 PM
motidave
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DavePolich - 04 February 2016 09:20 AM

First library from DCP for Montage will be Vintage Keys. Expected release first week of May.

It will be available at yamahamusicsoft.com. Not on Motifator.

Nice!  I can’t tell you how many songs I perform using VK today on my XF!

I know VK was mostly instrument based vs hit song specific.  But there’s a few song specific voices in the XS/XF version, like Jump, Lets Go, etc..  maybe you could add one for Bon Jovi Runaway? its my highest paying tribute act I work in ... very distinctive, hardest for me to create from scratch.  I’ve read it was created on an OB-Xa but don’t know how.

OT:  how much better will the Montage B’s Knees take rock hammonds vs XF?

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Posted on: February 08, 2016 @ 04:36 PM
aron
Total Posts:  87
Joined  02-20-2003
status: Experienced

So each knob can control multiple parameters and then the super knob controls all 8 at once? Yes that is powerful.

At that point, all I wish the Montage was able to do is record these modulations as sequences that are tied to a sound, so when you press the key, the entire sequence plays per note - like the SY22 did.
That would be the ultimate.

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Posted on: February 09, 2016 @ 07:46 AM
DschoKeys
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aron - 08 February 2016 04:36 PM

At that point, all I wish the Montage was able to do is record these modulations as sequences that are tied to a sound, so when you press the key, the entire sequence plays per note

As I understood it, that is exactly what a motion sequence on the Montage is doing:

DavePolich - 03 February 2016 08:32 AM

One of the things a motion sequence part assignment can do is control the Super Knob movement itself. That’s why some of the videos show the super knob glow “fluttering”...it’s moving extremely fast between states, and not just in a cyclical manner.

Regards, :)

Jo

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Posted on: February 09, 2016 @ 03:27 PM
aron
Total Posts:  87
Joined  02-20-2003
status: Experienced

But per note?

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