Where would I get more detailed info pertaining to Sequencing on the MOXF?

By that I mean more info than what’s in the MOXF Owners Manual.

I need answers (for now) such as:
1) How many Songs can it hold.
2) When I’m working on constructing the Sequences/Song and have to stop before the Song is finished, can I save it and finish it later?
3) Can the Song/unfinished Song be saved externally as a backup or when the total number of Songs limit is met?
4) Are there any Video Manuals available for Sequencing on the MOXF?

1) 64 Songs & 64 Patterns.

2) I think so....why not?:) just seems limited if not possible!

3) You can use John Melas Total Librarian. EDIT/Receive All
It Receives Voices/DR:User/Performances/Patters/songs & Masters
save as an *.allmoxf

4) Have no idea!

BTW have you checked the Reference Manual for more info on the Sequencer?

Thanks (and I will check the Reference Manual)!

Next question:

I want to have a four beat click recorded (as part of the song) on the first measure before I start
playing/recording the Into of the song on measure two.

How do I do that?

Right now there is no video manual on the MOXF specifically but there is one for the MOX, which will be applicable to the MOXF almost 100% regarding the sequencer. You can purchase physical the DVD in the Motifator shop: http://shop.motifator.com/index.php/dvds/motif-series-yamaha-dvds.htmlr or get the download over at our main company website http://www.keyfax.com.

MM

Hello MrMotif, how have you been?

I will buy it, but which do you prefer, the DVD or download (as they are very close in price)?

Regardless, is it possible to have a four beat click recorded on the Pattern/Sequence as a count in before I start playing?

Good to hear from you again!

Jerry

jerrydpi - 29 December 2013 10:45 AM

[...] I want to have a four beat click recorded (as part of the song) on the first measure before I start
playing/recording the Into of the song on measure two.

How do I do that?

It’s done with Sequencer Setup on the XF. That seems to be covered for the MOXF on page 144 of the Reference Manual.

Hello buddy!

1) When are you going to reveal the details of your experiment?
2) Were you surprised at the outcome of the comparison?

Thanks!

Jerry

Hello Jerry,

I’m good thanks!

If you record a 4 beat count-in directly to the Pattern then you’re going to be stuck with it every time the Pattern loops. If you don’t mind that you could snip that off once you have everything recorded I guess but you could be talking yourself into some editing headaches. You can alter the ‘actual’ count-in (not recorded) quite substantially. You could also record a count-in ‘as’ Section A if you want. You can record the count-in in Song mode pretty safely because Song mode is linear recording.

Hope that helps.

MM

5pinDIN - 29 December 2013 11:04 AM

jerrydpi - 29 December 2013 10:45 AM

[...] I want to have a four beat click recorded (as part of the song) on the first measure before I start
playing/recording the Into of the song on measure two.

How do I do that?

It’s done with Sequencer Setup on the XF. That seems to be covered for the MOXF on page 144 of the Reference Manual.

That page refers to Determines the number of count-in measures provided before recording actually starts after pressing the [ô€€³] (Play) button in the Record standby mode.

I want the one measure click to be recorded as part of the song.

I want that because I have learned from past experiences (bad, btw) that it’s hard to overdub/add a part precisely at the beginning of a song when there no count in to tell you where to start playing/singing.

MrMotif - 29 December 2013 11:10 AM

Hello Jerry,

I’m good thanks!

If you record a 4 beat count-in directly to the Pattern then you’re going to be stuck with it every time the Pattern loops. If you don’t mind that you could snip that off once you have everything recorded I guess but you could be talking yourself into some editing headaches. You can alter the ‘actual’ count-in (not recorded) quite substantially. You could also record a count-in ‘as’ Section A if you want. You can record the count-in in Song mode pretty safely because Song mode is linear recording.

Hope that helps.

MM

Glad to hear that things are good for you MM!

See my reply to 5pD as to why I need that count in at only the beginning of my song (unless there’s another way that I’m not thinking/don’t know about).

Would it be better to record the song in Song Mode instead of Pattern Mode (even though the Pattern Mode sounds very interesting)?

Thanks!

Jerry

PS

I overlooked your suggestion of having the count in recorded as Section A.

That might be the answer!

As an aside, which do you use most often, Pattern or Song?

Jerry

jerrydpi - 29 December 2013 11:13 AM

That page refers to Determines the number of count-in measures provided before recording actually starts after pressing the [ô€€³] (Play) button in the Record standby mode.

I want the one measure click to be recorded as part of the song.

I want that because I have learned from past experiences (bad, btw) that it’s hard to overdub/add a part precisely at the beginning of a song when there no count in to tell you where to start playing/singing.

That seems to point out another advantage of the XF over the MOXF. The XF could resample the click, then the sample triggered for count-in purpose.

That could also be done with a DAW, or the DAW’s built-in click used.

Where would I get more detailed info pertaining to Sequencing on the MOXF?

By that I mean more info than what’s in the MOXF Owners Manual.

The DVD for the MOX is on point, as recommended.

1) How many Songs can it hold.

I imagine no one has ever got 64 MIDI Songs in the sequencer! :-) unless they are children’s songs like “Mary had a Little Lamb”
There are 64 Song locations and 64 Pattern locations. What you mean by a “song” can vary. Some people never record to the sequencer… As you know, a Song Mixing setup can be used for a “live” stage configuration for all the Voices you need to switch seamlessly between while on stage in any one composition.

If you are talking about how much MIDI data can be recorded to the MOXF sequencer - the answer is 896KB. If that is one Song or ten or fifteen will depend on the song.
Question: How long is a song?
Response: how long is a piece of string?
Question: What piece of string?
Response: What song?

Seriously though, if your songs average around 100KB, that’s going to give about 8 or 9 songs.
If your songs average about 50KB then you’ll get around 16 to 18 songs.... Your mileage will vary.

2) When I’m working on constructing the Sequences/Song and have to stop before the Song is finished, can I save it and finish it later?

The MOXF internal memory works like this - if you are working on a Song and have to stop before the Song is finished:
Press [STORE]
Press [ENTER]
This writes the Song to internal flash ROM where it will stay until you either CLEAR it or Overwrite it. It remains in memory even if you power down and back up.

But if you don’t STORE and power down, your Song and the edit buffer it is in will be automatically cleared.

3) Can the Song/unfinished Song be saved externally as a backup or when the total number of Songs limit is met?

Once you have STORED the Sequencer data as outlined above, you can backup the Song sequencer in either an ALL data file (.X6A) or an ALL SONG file (.X6S). From either one of these files individual Songs can be loaded. It takes literally 1-2 seconds to load a Song.

So you know: the sequencer is designed to hold about a set’s worth of songs at once ( typically, your mileage may vary). You can reload at anytime in seconds. Between sets or whenever convenient.
( during the thunderous applause) :-)

4) Are there any Video Manuals available for Sequencing on the MOXF?

Sequencing on the MOXF is exactly like sequencing on the MOX so the DVD will cover that.

I want to have a four beat click recorded (as part of the song) on the first measure before I start
playing/recording the Into of the song on measure two.

How do I do that?

Record it on your Drum Track in Song mode… All 10 of the Click sounds are found in any Drum Kit voice? Simply begin the composition playing your count in measure 001 in SONG mode.

start overdubbing the rest of your tracks post your manual count-in

Remember, you can move data from Song mode to Pattern mode and back again. Why would you do that?
Excellent question! :-)
Songs in real life are linear, like Song mode. But if you play in a band, it is common practice to rehearse the band by playing a Section at a time. You might repeat a certain Section of the song over and over until everyone feels comfortable with there part… Then later you run through the entire composition.

Pattern mode is very much like that rehearsal space where you repeat a section over and over until you perfect it.... You can begin recording in Song mode… Record the entire introduction and maybe the Section that follows… You can then “split” any region of measures from your linear Song and export it (every setting, every voice, every part) to an empty Pattern Section.

While in that Pattern Section, you can workout the mistakes, change the feel, edit the data.... Perfect it! When you are happy, you can place that entire Section back into your linear Song at the appropriate measure.

Cut and Paste type action.

There is one sequencer in the MOXF. It has two related, interactive modes. You can move entire mixes between modes, you can move an individual phrase between modes… They each have their own strengths. Learning to move the data, work on it and replace it… Is a designed workflow.

The finished product is a linear Song. Pattern mode can be used to workout your ideas, try things out, perfect each section or “movement” (in classical music terms) then put the data back into the linear structure.

The article on “DRUM TRACK CONSTRUCTION TOOLS” goes over the Song/Pattern symbiotic relationship and shows how to move data between the modes.

Holy Crap Batman!!!

I understand what you’re trying to teach me (and all of us) in the above lesson :-)

I know now how to handle the count in and it overcomes a perceived weakness of the MOXF vs the XF (as my buddy 5pD was pointing out).

I’l start sequencing the song tomorrow night but I have two more questions on Sequencing tonight, as well as one question on another Topic that I just started.

1) I know how to turn a Performance into a Pattern on the Sequencer. I want that Performance to be Section B (the Intro after Section A which is the one measure count in).

The Performance has an ARP on Voice One (Drums) that I’m happy with and an ARP on Voice Three (Guitar) that I’m happy with.

When I start to Sequence Section C (the First Verse) I want to use the Same Performance, but this time I don’t want the ARP on the Third Voice (the Guitar) playing. I want to play/Sequence what I want the Guitar to play.

a) Do I turn that edited Performance into the Pattern Section C?
b) Do I just copy Section B and “paste it” into Section C, turn off the ARP and overdub the Guitar playing what I want?
c) None of the above :-)

Thanks!

Jerry

Bad_Mister - 29 December 2013 01:52 PM

Where would I get more detailed info pertaining to Sequencing on the MOXF?

By that I mean more info than what’s in the MOXF Owners Manual.

The DVD for the MOX is on point, as recommended.

1) How many Songs can it hold.

I imagine no one has ever got 64 MIDI Songs in the sequencer! :-) unless they are children’s songs like “Mary had a Little Lamb”
There are 64 Song locations and 64 Pattern locations. What you mean by a “song” can vary. Some people never record to the sequencer… As you know, a Song Mixing setup can be used for a “live” stage configuration for all the Voices you need to switch seamlessly between while on stage in any one composition.

If you are talking about how much MIDI data can be recorded to the MOXF sequencer - the answer is 896KB. If that is one Song or ten or fifteen will depend on the song.
Question: How long is a song?
Response: how long is a piece of string?
Question: What piece of string?
Response: What song?

Seriously though, if your songs average around 100KB, that’s going to give about 8 or 9 songs.
If your songs average about 50KB then you’ll get around 16 to 18 songs.... Your mileage will vary.

2) When I’m working on constructing the Sequences/Song and have to stop before the Song is finished, can I save it and finish it later?

The MOXF internal memory works like this - if you are working on a Song and have to stop before the Song is finished:
Press [STORE]
Press [ENTER]
This writes the Song to internal flash ROM where it will stay until you either CLEAR it or Overwrite it. It remains in memory even if you power down and back up.

But if you don’t STORE and power down, your Song and the edit buffer it is in will be automatically cleared.

3) Can the Song/unfinished Song be saved externally as a backup or when the total number of Songs limit is met?

Once you have STORED the Sequencer data as outlined above, you can backup the Song sequencer in either an ALL data file (.X6A) or an ALL SONG file (.X6S). From either one of these files individual Songs can be loaded. It takes literally 1-2 seconds to load a Song.

So you know: the sequencer is designed to hold about a set’s worth of songs at once ( typically, your mileage may vary). You can reload at anytime in seconds. Between sets or whenever convenient.
( during the thunderous applause) :-)

4) Are there any Video Manuals available for Sequencing on the MOXF?

Sequencing on the MOXF is exactly like sequencing on the MOX so the DVD will cover that.

I want to have a four beat click recorded (as part of the song) on the first measure before I start
playing/recording the Into of the song on measure two.

How do I do that?

Record it on your Drum Track in Song mode… All 10 of the Click sounds are found in any Drum Kit voice? Simply begin the composition playing your count in measure 001 in SONG mode.

start overdubbing the rest of your tracks post your manual count-in

Remember, you can move data from Song mode to Pattern mode and back again. Why would you do that?
Excellent question! :-)
Songs in real life are linear, like Song mode. But if you play in a band, it is common practice to rehearse the band by playing a Section at a time. You might repeat a certain Section of the song over and over until everyone feels comfortable with there part… Then later you run through the entire composition.

Pattern mode is very much like that rehearsal space where you repeat a section over and over until you perfect it.... You can begin recording in Song mode… Record the entire introduction and maybe the Section that follows… You can then “split” any region of measures from your linear Song and export it (every setting, every voice, every part) to an empty Pattern Section.

While in that Pattern Section, you can workout the mistakes, change the feel, edit the data.... Perfect it! When you are happy, you can place that entire Section back into your linear Song at the appropriate measure.

Cut and Paste type action.

There is one sequencer in the MOXF. It has two related, interactive modes. You can move entire mixes between modes, you can move an individual phrase between modes… They each have their own strengths. Learning to move the data, work on it and replace it… Is a designed workflow.

The finished product is a linear Song. Pattern mode can be used to workout your ideas, try things out, perfect each section or “movement” (in classical music terms) then put the data back into the linear structure.

The article on “DRUM TRACK CONSTRUCTION TOOLS” goes over the Song/Pattern symbiotic relationship and shows how to move data between the modes.

Last question on this one tonight.

My original song is about 3 minutes long.

I’m confident that when you turn the Performance into a Song (vs a Pattern) that it is using four tracks of the Sequencer.

If I Sequence my song in the Song Mode, can I Record/Copy/Sequence the entire Performance into a 3 minute Song and then go back to the various Sections of the Song (Intro/Verse/Chorus/etc), go to the Track (the third Track with the Guitar) that has the ARP going for the entire song and just overdub that Track with the Guitar riffs (in the appropriate Sections of the song) that I want?

If so, all I have to do then is Record/Sequence the remainder of the Tracks (5 to 16) as I so please.

If this question was intended for me, it’s Pattern mode all the way. But only because the work I do is inherently flexible - or rather needs to be. I’m no longer releasing records or producing ‘finished’ or ‘fixed’ pieces of music.

MM