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Viewing topic "Create Split Performance On The Fly?"

     
Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 11:22 AM
XSMercedes
Total Posts:  62
Joined  07-03-2007
status: Experienced

Is there a way to quickly create a 2 voice split performance on the fly as can be done with the s90xs? For instance, I was in voice mode and found Punchy Drone RB (Pre3, H06) and wanted to place it in the left hand with an analogue synth pad in the right hand, split around C3. Do I have to first opt out of voice mode, enter performance mode, look for an existing performance I can do without and write over and then initialize it using these 2 voices, by which time I have switched from performer to technician. Or is there a quick way to rapidly put one voice in the left hand and another voice in the right hand and keep playing? If not, I suggest this feature be added in the successor to the XF. Thanks in advance for any insight.

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 11:50 AM
Bad_Mister
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No. The S90XS and S70XS are stage versions of the Motif XS engine. A part of being “Stage” includes things like “Creating a Split or Layered Performance on the fly”.

The Motif-series paradigm is to plan ahead! The XF is a completely programmable synth… if that is not what you were looking for, we can highly recommend the Stage Synth: S90XS/S70XS which can create SPLITS as quick as a bunny.

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 11:56 AM
XSMercedes
Total Posts:  62
Joined  07-03-2007
status: Experienced

OK. Thank you Bad Mister. I will set up a template performance where I can quickly change voices. I appreciate your quick response.

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 12:18 PM
anotherscott
Total Posts:  652
Joined  06-30-2010
status: Guru

I ended up going with a MOX as a “stage” version of an XF, simply because I couldn’t deal with the travel weight of the XF *or* an S-XS. However, with only a *small* amount of pre-planning, I can do splits on the fly.

In my case, my LH is usually bass, and it is the RH sound I want to specify on the fly. I created a Performance with the LH set up the way I wanted it, and then during the gig, I leave it in “Edit” mode with the “right hand” part set for editing. I can then quickly call up whatever right hand sounds I want on the fly. Though it would also only take a single button-press to switch from RH sound selection to LH sound selection, if I were so inclined. In either case, though, if you’re doing this during performance, you need to know where the sound you want to get to is. I have my most commonly used sounds grouped together in a User bank, so I can mix-and-match among those pretty easily without hunting.

(A nice feature is that you can hit the Group button and see what sound is assigned to each of the main 16 buttons.)

Even adding a layer to one side of a split on the fly can be done pretty easily this way.

This is all based on my experience with the MOX, but I’m guessing that the XF would be similar.

So yes, there is some pre-planning, but it is minimal… it’s not like I need to set up every split I might want to use in advance, I just need to set up the environment that let’s me pretty freely pick and choose. Without this facility, the MOX would have been far less useful to me.

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 02:19 PM
XSMercedes
Total Posts:  62
Joined  07-03-2007
status: Experienced

Thank you anotherscott. Great idea. I had an s90xs and treaded it in for the XF8 because I missed all of the additional features that I had on my previous XS8. I did not think about keeping the performance in edit mode and lining up the user voices to move quickly from one to another. It seems that one thing leads to another. The XF8 is so large and heavy that I was considering a second vehicle just to transport it. I like your pragmatic and far more cost effective approach.

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 02:40 PM
Bad_Mister
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Well, if you’re not afraid of some pre-planning - the XF (with the latest update v1.40.x) you can setup a SONG or PATTERN MIXING program with your favorite ‘Right-hand’ sounds in PART 1-7, program your favorite Left-hand Bass in PART 8.
STORE the SONG or PATTERN.

Associate that with a MASTER program
Set the ZONE SWITCH = ON

ZONE 1 = channel 1 plays PART 1, set NOTE LIMITs for right hand (Piano)
ZONE 2 = channel 2 plays PART 2, set NOTE LIMITs for right hand (Organ)
ZONE 3 = channel 3 plays PART 3, set NOTE LIMITs for right hand (Electric Piano)
etc… through to
ZONE 7 = channel 7 plays PART 7, set NOTE LIMITs for right hand (Lead)
ZONE 8 = channel 8 plays PART 8 set NOTE LIMITs for left hand bass (Bass)

STORE the MASTER.

Press [PERFORMANCE CONTROL]

Buttons [1]-[8] will activate/deactivate the Voice in that internal ZONE

With lights 1 and 8 lit you could be playing a Piano with Bass
Press [1] and [2] simultaneously to turn OFF 1 and turn ON 2, now you have Organ with Bass
Press [2] and [3] simultaneously to turn OFF 2 and turn ON 3, now you have E.Piano with Bass
etc. use your imagination (what I’m suggesting here is only the tip of the iceberg… with 8 Zones you can be very creative with a minimum of pre-planning.
:-)
Want to create Layers? Light the Zone lights associated with the PARTs…

While [PERFORMANCE CONTROL] is lit in MASTER mode buttons [9]-[16] will activate/deactivate external ZONES

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 03:25 PM
anotherscott
Total Posts:  652
Joined  06-30-2010
status: Guru

That’s an interesting way to go, too, B_M. Compared to what I described, it would have the advantage (I think) of sounds not cutting off when you switched from one to the other, which I think is something hard to give up once you’ve played with it! The disadvantage, though, is that, to switch to a new sound, besides hitting the button to select that sound, you have to hit another button to deselect the previous sound, so it’s a little more cumbersome.

Though also, what about the display feature I mentioned? On the MOX, one thing I like about Performance Mode over Mix Mode is, as I said, you can hit the Group button, and you see a list of what sounds are currently assigned to the 16 buttons. On Mix mode, you lose that, so you need to memorize or write down what sound is under each button (perhaps for multiple different sets of 16 sounds). Would that differentiation hold true on the XF as well?

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Posted on: August 02, 2013 @ 05:03 PM
Bad_Mister
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The advantage is that in Performance mode you are always using polyphony for all four sounds at all times… Whether they are sounding or not, which can be an issue when you just 64 as in the MOX, while not so much on the XF. And seamless transitioning while I’m walking bass...? I’d have to really wonder about that. It is so very rare that I ever need that I don’t consider it that important (of course, your mileage may vary) I find giving music space to breathe is important… And on the odd song I need to transition from one instrument immediately to another I would setup ahead of time for that contingency. You have Foot Controllers for that kind of thing.

Having eight sounds at the ready, each using polyphony only when activated, and being able to switch, like anything, with practice you not only remember where you placed your Voices, it becomes quick, easy and efficient. No doubt the first time you use it, you might stumble, but that is what rehearsals are for. :-)

I never read during the gig, not even the list of sixteen sounds. I’d rather keep a consistent layout… But different strokes for different folks, I guess.

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Posted on: August 03, 2013 @ 01:30 AM
alanb
Total Posts:  301
Joined  02-15-2009
status: Enthusiast

I too have an XS8 which I use in live performance...and the weight is killing me. I have been looking at a MOX8 as a possible replacement...it seems to be the closest thing to the XS (which I love).

My concern is...the XS has two Foot Controllers which I use as #1 volume pedal & #2 Leslie speed control.The MOX8 has only one Foot Controller.

Is there some work around on the MOX to accommodate this?

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Posted on: August 03, 2013 @ 04:37 AM
XSMercedes
Total Posts:  62
Joined  07-03-2007
status: Experienced

Using Performance Control in Master Mode is my favorite feature for live playing. I have a 4 part rather symphonic performance I saved to a song using successive midi channels (1-4) for each of the 4 parts and successive midi channels (5-8) for the 4 parts I am not using. Then I saved that song to Master Mode, zone switch selected, and activate the Performance Control button. Now although I have programmed FC1 to control the volume on only the internal string voice in the performance and FC2 to control only the volume of the internal flute voice so I can sweep either in or out easily, by activating or deactivating part select buttons 1-4 I can also selectively turn on or off each of the 4 internal parts. I leave part select buttons 5-8 deactivated.

But here is what I find really great. Part buttons 9-16 activate or deactivate the external voices on an external instrument assigned to the respective midi channels on buttons 1-8 directly above the respective 9-16 buttons (in my case channels 1-8). In other words, if button 6 activates internal midi channel 6, button 14 will turn on or off midi channel 6 on an external instrument.

Now I use an iPad as my external virtual keyboard and can open up to 8 different apps (or use Cubasis with 2+/- midi tracks with one of its virtual instruments assigned to each track) and assign a different midi channel (1-8) to each open app (or Cubasis instrument track) with “Background Midi” set to on. Then by activating or deactivating Part Select buttons 9-16 I can choose which one or all (subject to iPad memory limitations) of the iPad apps, each with a unique sound, I want to play with each other and/or my internal voices. It’s a lot of fun.

This may not be on point with this thread, but it follows the above discussion and an iPad is easily connected to a MOX or XF for an additional lightweight “keyboard”.

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Posted on: October 18, 2014 @ 05:39 PM
anotherscott
Total Posts:  652
Joined  06-30-2010
status: Guru
Bad_Mister - 02 August 2013 05:03 PM

seamless transitioning while I’m walking bass...? I’d have to really wonder about that. It is so very rare that I ever need that I don’t consider it that important (of course, your mileage may vary).

Actually, my single biggest need for seamless transition is while doing left hand bass! If I’m on a single board, playing LHB, my right hand may need to, for example, play piano in the verse, strings in the chorus, and a lead sound in the bridge. Using standard Performances for these things--i.e. a Performance for Bass+Piano, another for Bass+Strings, another for Bass+Lead--you have to time your transitions just right in order to avoid an audible glitch in the bass line (i.e. a note cutting off prematurely). That’s why I use the MOX in the “open edit” mode I described, so I can freely change the RH sound, and the LHB never glitches. The ability to do this is very important on any board I want to use for split LHB. Luckily, the MOX can do it… if you play while in editing mode. Which is a little weird, and perhaps not entirely obvious, but it works.

I think another way to do it would be in Mix mode. Using the same example, you could put piano on channel 1, strings on channel 2, lead on channel 3, each with key ranges above the split point, and then also (below the split point) put a bass on channel 1, another copy of the same bass sound on channel 2, and another copy of the same bass sound on channel 3. I haven’t tried it, but that might work. But you’d only have 8 RH sounds to choose from at any given time, a limitation that doesn’t exist in the “open edit” Performance mode, where I can call up any RH sound at all (and I have the 16 buttons set to call up my most commonly used 16 sounds).

If there is some other, better way to handle non-glitch LHB while changing RH sounds, I’d like to know about it!

Bad_Mister - 02 August 2013 05:03 PM

with practice you not only remember where you placed your Voices, it becomes quick, easy and efficient. ...
I never read during the gig, not even the list of sixteen sounds. I’d rather keep a consistent layout… But different strokes for different folks, I guess.

If you play the same songs using the same few sounds all the time, that works. And I do know which buttons will bring me to my most common Voices. But I have less commonly used voices in my 2nd and 3rd banks, and those locations aren’t memorized. Some are Voices I rarely use, I may go weeks or months without needing them.  Some are sounds set up for particular songs, and only used for those songs (and named accordingly). Again, we may go weeks or months without playing that song at a gig. But when I need these sounds, I really like the way I can call up a screen and see which sound is under which button. I’ve missed that when I’ve played with Mix mode (as opposed to Performance or Voice mode) on a MOX. I think you do get that functionality on the XF, though.

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