Old Motifator threads are available in the Archive.
MarPabl
Total Posts: 560
Joined 09-08-2011 status: Guru |
For me, FW16E is better than Kronos exactly because you get more audio I/O channels and you can even daisy chain with other Yamaha gear. Regarding the integration, I’ve seen both have templates to connect with several DAW’s so IMHO there’s no great difference there. However, this is a feature I don’t usually need so I don’t have a solid opinion here. Yes, I think it’s important for you to decide first if you like more the sounds on the Motif XF and then, don’t forget all the additional cool features you currently don’t have with the XS rack. While you’re somewhat covered with your other gear (sequencing, sampling, easier editing, better UI), I think it’s a nice comparison point to make. |
Apex
Total Posts: 683
Joined 10-21-2005 status: Guru |
I opened it… When you say daisy chain with other Yamaha gear… do you mean ONLY yamaha gear? or can you daisy chain it with ANY firewire device? |
SuperPartyRobot
Total Posts: 125
Joined 10-19-2007 status: Pro |
Anything that uses the Yamaha Steinberg FW ASIO driver for audio/midi integration. You can daisy chain something like a hard drive, but that’s not really considered integration. |
Apex
Total Posts: 683
Joined 10-21-2005 status: Guru |
(if I even buy it) i would want to daisy chain it with my mackie onyx 1220i audio interface..... |
MarPabl
Total Posts: 560
Joined 09-08-2011 status: Guru |
I don’t think you can daisy chain Motif XF with the Onyx 1220i because the Mackie doesn’t use the Yamaha Steinberg Firewire… Check those threads with additional information:
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philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
I hope my post here is not considered hijacking. I did not want to start another kronos versus motif, etc. I’m also undecided regarding my choice of workstation, but considering that I’m obligated to make a decision in about four weeks, here are some comments and questions: “Workstation” for my applications require a higher priority for a stand-alone, all-in-one-box machine. I do not want to have to make-up for insufficient song composition capabilities by having to use a DAW, even though I have an excellent DAW setup. The synthesis capabilities are not the most important to me since the sounds of kronos, motif, fantom and pc3 are all sufficient for my purposes, especially since I’m good at editing. Most workstation users, from what I have gathered, don’t put a high priority on sequencer functions/performance. Another thing is file management- internal and external. I don’t find any of the manufacturer’s methods to be excellent, so there has to be a best choice for my preferences, so I’d really like to here some details on this subject please.
Regarding song composition and sequence functionality:
I have more questions, but I’d like to hear more before adding anything else.
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MichaelJHuman
Total Posts: 369
Joined 09-04-2007 status: Enthusiast |
As for (2), I think the XF covers you. I have never used the capability, but there’s a mixing voice concept on the Motif. I believe you simply edit the voice from mixing screen, and when you save the pattern/song, it saves changes locally as a mixing voice. If I read the manual correctly, there’s 256 slots in which mixing voices are saved to, so there’s a limit, but it seems pretty good unless you create a ton of songs/patterns with a lot of edited voices. Of course you always have the option of editing a preset or copying a present to a user voice and editing that (as memory serves.) |
philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
That is nice in theory, but are you allowed to edit the voice-in full- as if doing it from the actual voice edit and while PLAY is engaged? |
MarPabl
Total Posts: 560
Joined 09-08-2011 status: Guru |
If you’re good at editing/programming, maybe Kronos is a better choice because it gives you 9 synth engines, while Motif XF gives you just one.
IMHO it’s easier to build a PERFORMANCE/SONG/PATTERN on Motif XF because the IFX of the (up to 8) VOICES will be immediately available if you wish. With Kronos, you have to remap the IFX for each PROGRAM you add to the COMBI/SONG. However, with Kronos you have 12 IFX at the PROGRAM level, while on Motif XF you just have 2 IFX at VOICE level.
If you’ll use many personalized samples, maybe Motif XF is better if you add Flash memory expansion boards. By doing so, your waveforms will always be available without needing to reload those each time you turn on the workstation. Regarding file management, both let you use USB memory sticks and Kronos gives you additionally and internal hard disk. Motif XF, additionally gives you Windows network connectivity. Lastly, Kronos will give you up to 4 GB to access the factory preset multisamples and your user defined multisamples (you can choose which factory samples to load), with Motif XF you’ll get up to 2.9 GB to access the factory waveforms as well as you user defined waveforms.
Motif XF gives you 2 paradigms: SONG (linear) and PATTERN so it’s actually better than Kronos for this. Kronos has RPPR and Cue Lists (Motif XF has CHAINS which are similar), but Kronos is not as powerful as Motif XF.
What kind of editing are you looking for? With both you can record CC MIDI messages and therefore you can alter each PART/TRACK realtime while recording/playing. If you use MIXING VOICES, you won’t be affected if the original VOICES are changed. For this point, Motif XF is better. However, Kronos has AMS which lets you map and combine more parameters to MIDI CC so maybe Kronos is more flexible than Motif XF. |
philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
Thanks MarPabl for your time.
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philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
OK MarPabl, I’m going to respond with clearer questions/comments according to your replies/recommendations at various points:
... As with xv-5080 editing performance allowed separate location and buffer to avoid having to know which programs are used by current combi/performance, so you retained two versions. yes, I know that one can copy programs/combis to new user locations and then reference all edits to there, but the various companies systems vary, better or worse.
Enough for now, so for practicality, I’ll see how the advice/recommendations go and then continue. I suppose one might say, get an XV-5080. Its not an option. The requirement is ONE workstation with the best or least compromises for my intent.
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5pinDIN
Total Posts: 11891
Joined 09-16-2010 status: Legend |
See “Mixing Voice Edit”, page 198, etc., of the XF Reference Manual.
If you don’t already have it, a PDF copy is available at:
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philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
Thank you 5pinDIN:
I read through the various pages starting from 198 and then, as usual had to jump around.
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MarPabl
Total Posts: 560
Joined 09-08-2011 status: Guru |
I personally prefer Motif XF for acoustic sounds, specially strings (violin, viola, cello, etc.) and all the sounds you’ve mentioned. For this, Motif XF gets my preference by much. I’ve never been inspired by Korg with acoustic string sounds. But this is a subjective opinion and a matter of taste. Regarding STR-1 of Kronos, you get some really cool guitars but I also like what Motif XF has to offer, specially the XA (expanded articulations) for acoustic guitars.
HD-1 and AWM2 are very different so there are many points of comparison here, it’s better to focus on certain features. Generally speaking, with Motif XF you get better control for individual waveforms which are assigned to ELEMENTS (up to 8 of those) You have individual Pitch, Filter, Amplitude, LFO settings, IFX, etc. for each individual ELEMENT. With HD-1 you get up to 2 Oscillators, but each one can have up to 8 multisamples (and also wave sequences) so you get parameters for Filter, Amplitude, LFO settings, IFX, etc. just for each Oscillator (maybe less granular control) Of course, there are a many many additional differences…
If the workflow for effects management is not a concern, IMHO Kronos is more flexible than Motif XF. Initially you can think Motif XF gives you more effects: up to 16 IFX (made by 2 IFX for up to 8 VOICES), 2 system effects (reverb and chorus) and one Master Effect, totalling 19 effects. With Kronos you’ll get: 12 IFX, 2 Master Effects and 2 Total Effects, totalling 16 effects. But there are synth engines which have built in effects, like the EP-1, CX-3 or the Polysix so for certain COMBI/SEQUENCES you could have 32 additional effects totalling 48 effects!
With both you can indeed create control data by specifying CC#/Aftertouch/Pitchbend. So you’re somewhat covered regarding this.
On both, you can edit filter cutoff/resonance by recording physical controllers assigned to those parameters. Regarding envelopes, some parameters are available (EG release for example)
MIXING voices on Motif XF work this way. You don’t need to create a new different VOICE just to have a new version which will fit on the SONG/PATTERN, as you usually need with Korg. |
philmagnotta
Total Posts: 261
Joined 10-19-2003 status: Enthusiast |
Thank you MarPabl:
You’ve given me a lot to consider. I still need to consider all the things we’ve discussed, so I’m going to have a more detailed look at the motif manuals, as much as I find them to be poorly written, I’ll have to do it.
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