Hello Motifators!

My MOX8 is great! But started recording individual tracks with my DAQ.  When set to USB Audio 1&2;, I hear no effects applied.

1) UTILITY:  Make sure 4ch audio chosen and 2Stereo chosen
2) Choose “SONG”, go to “01 ClubWorx” (as an example)
3) Hit [>] (play)
4) MIXING ==> EDIT ==> USB I/O ==> Set a track to 1&2;(instead of 3&4;)

Result: Effects for that track are lost only when 1&2;selected.

What am I missing? Shouldn’t the USB output be irrelevant?

- Ryan

Welcome to the forums! Excellent question. This addresses both workflow and signal flow issues within the MOX…

The output that is selected is not irrelevant - it is critical.

If you are using setup #1: DAW REC, please see the signal flow diagram for a graphic view of what is available. There is no one way to work. In fact the MOX allows you to develop your own method depending on what you want to do. Please remember it is up to you.

But here is what is going on:

DAW REC
_ The AD input is fixed to USB 1/2
_ The internal PARTS initially default to USB 3/4 (but importantly, you can route any PART to the USB 1/2 bus at anytime).

This setup allows the user to record whatever is coming in the AD Input to a separate Track in the DAW while the synth Parts are recorded to outputs USB 3/4. You could connect a microphone to the AD Input, or you could connect a guitar, or it could be a stereo feed from your band’s mixing console. With two stereo bus outputs, you can record the AD PART separate from your MOX PARTS.

But let’s say you are just recording the internal MOX sounds. Then we need to discuss how you can make use of the dual stereo record bus outputs to accomplish your goals....
Of course, you could record everything as a stereo audio output in a single pass.
You could record each PART to it’s own audio track by routing the parts to one or the other of the Stereo buses (USB 1/2, or USB 3/4). that is what we will now discuss:

The difference is shown in the signal flow chart (see attachment below). To anyone reading this: an important skill you will want to add to your own personal home studio knowledge base is the ability to read a flow chart. It is the easiest way to learn about what options you have and what work methods will be open for you.

Press [UTILITY]
Press [F5] USB I/O
Here you are set to “2StereoRec” (Dual Stereo Record mode)
Press [SF6] INFO
Here you can see the signal flow diagram - study it closely.

Initially, all internal PARTS start out routed to USB bus 3/4 - which as you can see if follow the signal flow - can use an INS (Insertion Effect) > travel through the SYSTEM Effects > and through the MFX (Master Effect) before going to the DAW.

To see the routing selection of the internal PARTS press the following:
From your SONG or PATTERN
Press [MIXING]
Press [EDIT]
Press [COMMON]
Press [F4] USB I/O

Here you can see that each PART is set to 3/4 but you can re-route them as you require when you are set to transfer them as audio outputs. This is very powerful and very useful when deciding what you want to record and how you want to record (for that matter).

If you re-route a PART by changing it’s OUTPUT SELECT to USB 1/2 you are removing it from the communal System and Master Effects. You are sending it to the USB 1/2 OUT, which does not travel through these effects.

In general, in any recording situation if you are going to isolate individual Parts to track’s you want to separate it from the shared effects. After all to isolate it means you want ONLY that Part, alone, on it’s track. The ‘communal’ nature of the SYSTEM and MASTER effects means all Parts are or can share these effects. REVERB (System) Effect is like a giant pool to which all channels have a send amount. You may have a snare drum swimming around in there along with the lead synth, the strings, and brass… Each PART with a different SEND amount may have a signal using that Reverb effect. The signal going to the Reverb is a composite signal (a sum of all the Sends) and is the antithesis of ISOLATION.

If you choose to record a PART separately, you can route it to USB 1/2, notice the line connecting it to USB 1/2 is post the INS. This means you can assign INSERTION Effects to it before you re-route it to the USB 1/2 bus. So to say it has no effects is incorrect - because you can assign it any two Insertion Effects prior to routing it to the USB 1/2 output.

Just FYI: When “printing” PARTS to your DAW as audio, you can apply INSERTION EFFECTS, as you send it, this overcomes the limit to the number of simultaneous INSERTION EFFECTs available. Since you are tracking/printing the audio tracks one at a time, you can re-allocate your INSERTION EFFECTS so that you can print each VOICE with its own 2 Insertion Effects as you go!!!

The concept is that you can prepare each individual PART before you commit it to AUDIO.

That all said, what if you would prefer to record a Part to your DAW separately, but still use the SYSTEM Effects (Reverb and Chorus) and the Master Effect...?
To maintain isolation you can simply assign all other PARTs to USB 1/2, leave the Part you want to record routed to USB 3/4. And then simply arm a stereo TRACK in your DAW set to receive USB 3/4. (In this case, you have isolated the PART you want to record by telling all the other PARTS to “get out of the pool” if you will, now the part you are going to print is the only one swimming in the communal effects pool. :)

There is no one way or even one recommended way to work. It is entirely up to you. It is extremely flexible. It is based on how large professional systems are fundamentally designed. Isolate Parts to a separate bus means taking the signal out of the general population and routing sans the system effects. But you can certainly work the other way round as long as you realize that the System Output will potentially contain other signals.

Hope that helps. We will be posting the first of several in depth article on this shortly… And there is DVD in production.

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Perfect and well written response. Thank you!

This is Day 2 of using my MOX8, and I’ve learned a lot. (My first experience with any ‘Motif’. A lot to learn.) Thanks for attaching the Diagram. In the Reference Manual, I was accidentally looking at the VST diagram (which has no PART -> USB1&2;connection). Your diagram was directly below it ;) Oops.

After posting, I actually did exactly what you suggested: Set all others to 1&2;, and my ‘wanted’ track to 3&4;.  This worked perfectly.

How I got to this point:
Bad_Mister, it was your ”Never run out of Polyphony” post that got me into this situation :) Thank you for that informative post as well.

You described a cool technique to essentially get ‘unlimited’ polyphony:
1) I route a track’s audio over 1&2;to be recorded by my DAW. (This works).

2) I turn off MIDI Rec for that track (getting back my polyphony), and output audio from my DAW into the MOX8 (This works.) I use the DAW LEVEL to control input volume.

So my question:
In the above scenario, do you somehow apply the SYSTEM effects to the DAW input after all tracks are ‘printed’ to the DAW?

Thanks,
- Ryan

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