Where does the Logic user fit into all this? My Mac’s FW800 port is already tied up with an interface & disc drive.

So the Mlan expansion card uses a different protocol than the FW16e card, so does the firewire on the MR816 card use the mlan drivers? What type is it? If so, would you be able to use it with the with the Motif FW16e in conjunction with another mlan device? i.e. MR816, Motif (FW16e), N12 mixer combination?

The firewire connection in the Steinberg MR816X/MR816CSX uses only the Yamaha Steinberg FW Driver.

Yes, you can use the FW16E in a setup with either the MR816s and/or the n8/n12 mixing desks. Any combination of devices totalling 3 plus the computer. For example, (2) MR816s plus a Motif XF would give you 48 audio inputs to your DAW. Another setup could be an n12, plus a Motif XF w/FW16E, and a Motif-Rack XS with mLAN16E2 (again providing 48 inputs to your DAW). All would use the Yamaha Steinberg FW driver (currenlty V1.6.0)

I’d like to take digital audio out via firewire from the XF and get it into an 02R96. Am I right that the FW16E is not compatible with the RME FireFace or the TC Digital Konnekt 32 or any firewire device not running Steinberg drivers, but is compatible with the Steinberg MR816X or MR816CSX? Would it be possible to: A) Get 8 channels of digital audio from the XF via firewire through a MR816X and then into an 02R96 via Adat connection with the MR816X locked to the 02R96 via BNC Word Clock and the XF locked to the MR816X via firewire B) Simultaneously have the XF connected to a PC running Cubase/XF Patch Editor via firewire? Sure is expensive to get multitrack digital audio out of an XF to anywhere but a PC, (FW16E + MR816X = $1000), if it can be done at all.

I’d like to take digital audio out via firewire from the XF and get it into an 02R96. Am I right that the FW16E is not compatible with the RME FireFace or the TC Digital Konnekt 32 or any firewire device not running Steinberg drivers, but is compatible with the Steinberg MR816X or MR816CSX?

Partially right. You are correct that the FW16E is not compatible with the RME Fireface or the TC Digital Konnekt 32 - as they are interfaces that do not take firewire input from an external device. As far as I know, they connect via firewire to the HOST (computer). They do not take an external devices firewire input… Like most firewire devices of this type (including the MR816’s) the firewire connection is for communication to and from the DAW (to and from the computer). I could be wrong I don’t really know that much about the RME or the TC units.

The Motif XF with its FW16E is an external source. So you cannot connect it to the RME, you cannot connect it to the TC Digital Konnekt 32, and the connection to the MR816 is only so that its data passes through it on the way to the computer.

So, there is currently no way to get multiple digital firewire outputs from the Motif XF w/FW16E simultaneously into the 02R96 - without going through the DAW software (computer). Sorry.

Would it be possible to: A) Get 8 channels of digital audio from the XF via firewire through a MR816X and then into an 02R96 via Adat connection with the MR816X locked to the 02R96 via BNC Word Clock and the XF locked to the MR816X via firewire

The Motif XF w/FW16E can send 16 channels of digital audio directly to your computer via firewire. The Yamaha Steinberg FW Driver is a peer-to-peer driver. Each device connects its audio buses to and from the computer… even though the physical FW connection is a “daisy-chain”, in reality the 16 audio buses of the XF arrive at your computer, the 16 audio buses of the MR816 arrive at the computer. The audio is never processed by the MR816 (unless you route it back via the DAW).

The YSFW driver allows for three devices to be daisy-chained. Each however, is addressing the computer directly. All routing post the DAW is up to you.

The 02R96 (when expanded with a MY16-mLAN) was a member of a family of products that could use the mLAN driver (not a peer-to-peer situation - but a true network of devices). In an mLAN setup, you could route the output of any node to the input of any other node, as you desired. Unfortunately, that is no longer available for the new generation of Yamaha Firewire products. Yes, it was far more flexible - however, the peer-to-peer connectivity of the current products is more in line with the target market (quick, easy, automatic connection, and no patchbay to figure out).

So, again, no. There is no way to connect the FW16E (Motif XF’s FW output) to anything but a computer - that is, its audio goes directly to the DAW, not to the MR816 (even though physically the FW cable connect to it, the data simply pass through it on its way to the DAW).

B) Simultaneously have the XF connected to a PC running Cubase/XF Patch Editor via firewire? Sure is expensive to get multitrack digital audio out of an XF to anywhere but a PC, (FW16E + MR816X = $1000), if it can be done at all.

If your goal is to send audio from the Motif XF to the 02R96, you would need to connect it via either the analog outputs (you have L/R stereo and two assignable output) or use the stereo digital coaxial output.

The problem with your math is this: it is not possible to get multi-track digital audio out of the XF and send it anywhere but a PC. The purpose of the FW16E is precisely that: to get multi-track digital audio out of the XF and send it to your computer, period.

From 2003 through 2007 a valiant attempt was made to market other types of destinations but that opportunity is now past. It included a family of products that include the 0-series mixers (01V96, 02R96) the DM-series of mixers (DM1000, DM2000) via the MY16-mLAN card, dedicated mLAN mixers and I/O devices 01X, and i88X, synthesizers (Motif ES, S90 ES)

All that said, the reason to route individual channels of a synthesizer like the XF to a mixer like the 02R96 (prior to recording it) is almost eliminated because of the quality of the digital processing available within the synth’s own mixer.

With each of the PARTS having its own EQ, access to the same VCM Effects you can have in the 02R96, it is almost a moot point.

We are not sure about your particular application, but until you have really worked with the internal processing of the XF you may be unaware of just how powerful it is.

Anyway hope that helps.

Thanks for the explanations of all of this.

In the thread here : http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/450446/

it looks as though you can put a Yamaha mLAN16E2 into a Motif XF8.

Does that mean that, if I put an Yamaha mLAN16E2 in my XF8 and connect it to my i88x, then I would be able to get 8 channels of XF to Adat and into an 02R96 with Adat cards in it, or perhaps more channels with the XF8 with a mLAN16E2 in it going to a 02R96 with a MY16-mLAN in it?

If so, and this may seem silly, but here’s what I need to know:
The ES8+mLAN16E->i88x -> Adat out to 02R96 can’t get the simple left/right output with all effects from the ES8.
The XF8/FW16E CAN send the left/right output plus all effects through firewire to a PC.
Can the XF8+mLAN16E2->i88x -> Adat to 02R96 OR XF8+mLAN16E2 -> 02R96+MY16-mLAN get the simple stereo output plus all effects out of the XF8 and into an 02R96? (Locked to external clock with additional XF channels without effects perhaps) Maybe the XS could do this, I wouldn’t know.

Has anyone tested the mLAN16E2 in an XF to see if it will fry the XF, that is, cook it to a crispy cinder, golden brown and sizzling with deep-down charcoal flavor?

it looks as though you can put a Yamaha mLAN16E2 into a Motif XF8.

Yes you can, and you would then need to update it to IEEE1394 Firmware 1.08 to make it work properly.

Does that mean that, if I put an Yamaha mLAN16E2 in my XF8 and connect it to my i88x, then I would be able to get 8 channels of XF to Adat and into an 02R96 with Adat cards in it, or perhaps more channels with the XF8 with a mLAN16E2 in it going to a 02R96 with a MY16-mLAN in it?

I think we’ve had this discussion. No… it does not. The XF will not work with the mLAN16E2 connected to any of the legacy products i88X, 01X, or digial console with MY16-mLAN. Because those devices use the mLAN Driver, you cannot select the mLAN Driver in the XF hardware. Sorry.

If it were compatible Yamaha would be shouting it from the rooftops.. it is not.

DavePolich - 02 September 2010 05:45 PM

Politically incorrect dave here with an observation.

Really, with FireWire and streaming audio, you may really be gaining nothing with the possible exception of a little speed in workflow. Make that very little, in my experience.

Dave

I’d like to start using virtual instruments on stage. I’ve heard about different brass vi’s that are good

i’ll be using a XF7 , Roland A70 , Roland Jv1080 ,

I have a small 6 ch rack mount mixer motu Av midi interface.
I plan on getting a Mac pro (using ? cubase or pro tools)

I trying to decide if i’ll need the expansion on my XF7 (FW) in order to make things simplier with cables.

Also i’d like to have all of my program changes setup as a song, So i’ll just have to call up a song and have all of my patches , splits and layers with different controllers for vol. using pedal.
Right now i need to decide if i’ll need the expansion for the motif xf7.
I’ve also thought about getting a yam 01 or 02 mixer to use with this setup.

Not quite sure how the vi’s work and how user friendly on stage this will be.

fbarbin