SY99 $3999 back in 1992, 16 notes of AFM plus 16 notes of AWM (sample playback) a huge 8MB wave ROM ... 15 track sequencer + Track 16 was the PATTERN track. 3.5” Floppy Disk drive 2DD (double density disks)… :-)

$4000 in 1992 money, go figure… what’s that today?

WesEXer - 05 August 2010 09:08 AM

The general public isn’t hip to these drives though

Hard disks are still way cheaper for the same capacity, $150 can buy you either 60 GB SSD or 2 TB HDD; smaller SSDs have made their way to portable computers though.

so maybe that’s why Yamaha chose not to go this route? OR it’s a control/profit thing? OR they’d have to add an SATA controller and support for it

They just didn’t want to make major changes to the OS and the hardware platform.

BTW next generation flash card formats such as SDXC and CFast should offer similar speeds in a year or two (CFast is internally based on SATA 600) and support for flash-friendly file systems like exFAT.

Bad_Mister - 05 August 2010 09:45 AM

$4000 in 1992 money, go figure… what’s that today?

DmitryKo - 05 August 2010 11:10 AM

Bad_Mister - 05 August 2010 09:45 AM

$4000 in 1992 money, go figure… what’s that today?

About $6200 according to http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

To keep everything fair though, you have to take into account the relative cost of components as well. A chip that would have cost $50 to make in ‘92 would probably cost a fraction of that today. On the other hand, today’s components were in many cases simply not available at any cost in ‘92, so there is another adjustment to take into account the cost of the extra features/power available in modern hardware.

It’s not a sum I feel qualified to calculate with any degree of precision.

I’d be interested to know how much an SY99 (the same specs as the original, but using modern fabrication) would cost to make today. I would imagine it to be less (even accounting for inflation) than it did then.

Df.

DmitryKo:

I don’t know that the OP was talking about anything other than standard hard drives when he posted. The Solid State drives have been appearing in laptops and are going to be utilized more and more.

You could very well be right about this, but there has to be a reason that Yamaha went the route they did. On my ES8 I bought over the counter RAM for the sampler and had to load it up via a USB stick. Anything that was sizeable took too long to load for gigs. And if there was a power failure in the middle of a set....

Time will tell if the next generation of Motif workstations use off the shelf memory again (I doubt it). I worked in the computer reseller business for 15 years and when 3rd party devices got in the mix we never knew what the results were going to be. Compaq Computer put the skids to off-the-shelf parts back in the eighties because they determined that the bulk of tech support calls were from customers that owned a Compaq Computer and had some kind of 3rd party device installed in it. Compaq closed their system and started installing proprietary components in them. People complained, but the performance and reliability of their systems sat well with corporate America because they didn’t have to deal with regular equipment breakdowns.

There has to be a reason(s) Yamaha went the route they did. I don’t think that the price of a 1GB Flash drive by Yamaha that I know is going to work and be guaranteed by Yamaha is too expensive.

Cheers,

Mike T.

miket156 - 05 August 2010 12:15 PM

I don’t know that the OP was talking about anything other than standard hard drives when he posted.

beechit - 04 August 2010 03:54 PM

why didn’t they just add an SSD SATA 1.8 or 2.5” interface to the XF?

Note how he mentions “SSD SATA”.

There has to be a reason(s) Yamaha went the route they did. I don’t think that the price of a 1GB Flash drive by Yamaha that I know is going to work and be guaranteed by Yamaha is too expensive.

Dreamflight - 05 August 2010 11:25 AM

To keep everything fair though, you have to take into account the relative cost of components as well. A chip that would have cost $50 to make in ‘92 would probably cost a fraction of that today. On the other hand, today’s components were in many cases simply not available at any cost in ‘92, so there is another adjustment to take into account the cost of the extra features/power available in modern hardware.

One thing is for certain, current digital synths and samplers cost less than their counterparts from 1980s and 1990s when you take inflation into account.

SYEMB05 = SY Expansion Memory Boards allowed you to add 512Kb of battery backed RAM to the SY99 and there were 5 slots. The SY99 came with 512Kb (that is not a misprint - I mean kilobytes of RAM on board and you can add 5 x 512Kb for a total of 3MB in a full expanded SY99.

If I recall the SYEMB05’s retailed for $395 a board!!!

Just FYI.

DmitryKo - 05 August 2010 01:10 PM

Dreamflight - 05 August 2010 11:25 AM

To keep everything fair though, you have to take into account the relative cost of components as well. A chip that would have cost $50 to make in ‘92 would probably cost a fraction of that today. On the other hand, today’s components were in many cases simply not available at any cost in ‘92, so there is another adjustment to take into account the cost of the extra features/power available in modern hardware.

Please let me know when you have a scientifically proven method to account for all these variables :)

One thing is for certain, current digital synths and samplers cost less than their counterparts from 1980s and 1990s when you take inflation into account.

Didn’t you read the second half of my original post - you essentially repeated back what I already wrote, just in different words.

To the first point I said:
It’s not a sum I feel qualified to calculate with any degree of precision.

To the second I said:
I’d be interested to know how much an SY99 (the same specs as the original, but using modern fabrication) would cost to make today. I would imagine it to be less (even accounting for inflation) than it did then.

I think we agree, like-for-like kit costs less now than it did then ... :)

Df.

Bad_Mister - 05 August 2010 09:45 AM

SY99 $3999 back in 1992, 16 notes of AFM plus 16 notes of AWM (sample playback) a huge 8MB wave ROM ... 15 track sequencer + Track 16 was the PATTERN track. 3.5” Floppy Disk drive 2DD (double density disks)… :-)

$4000 in 1992 money, go figure… what’s that today?

An Open Labs device today....Oh wait, they went bankrupt....Never mind.....ZR

It’s not that the XF isn’t a great board....It’s that people have changed the mindset of how they spend money.....This is going to be an extremely hard sell to XS owners I think...I know the recession has totally changed my mindset on EVERYTHING I buy...The days of swiping the credit card and making payments are over for the majority of people I know....I’m really glad that Yamaha is ahead of the pack because it’s great products and great value that I want to have around for a long time to come...It’s just like everything else though, it’s going to be hard as heck to get my money for anything right now because before I make a purchase on anything I ask- Do I really need that and is it worth it?....Hopefully the answer will be yes to many out there....ZR

Won’t buy a new motif unless they put a robotic Bad_Mister inside it!

miket156 - 04 August 2010 04:10 PM

There are a number of people posting that unless Yamaha builds a synthesizer to their specifications, they won’t be buying an XF.

You should check the prices of custom guitars for comparison. You’ll find that the Motif XF is a bargain compared to a $6,000 custom guitar with a shiny finish that has ONE SOUND.

Get real.

Mike T.[/quote

Agree with you 100% Mike.  If the XF isnt for you...cool!  In a down economy, who has put out a new workstation that you do want?  oh thats rght, NOBODY!  The way i see it, this board should make the ES users salivate.  It is a glorified XS.  As a Studio Owner, im gonna keep my XS8 in the studio now, and im gonna get a XF7 and gig with it.  Thanks Yamaha.

Dreamflight - 05 August 2010 01:49 PM

I’d be interested to know how much an SY99 (the same specs as the original, but using modern fabrication) would cost to make today.

BTW how much does it cost to re-implement FM synthesis on a new quality level in CP-1 stage piano, which has virtual FM modelling (though it doesn’t have AWM2 voices at all) and a price of $5000? How would it compare to a $300 PLG-DX150 board which had the original full-featured OPL4 ASIC from the DX-series? I have no answer.

[

miket156 - 04 August 2010 04:10 PM

There are a number of people posting that unless Yamaha builds a synthesizer to their specifications, they won’t be buying an XF.

You should check the prices of custom guitars for comparison. You’ll find that the Motif XF is a bargain compared to a $6,000 custom guitar with a shiny finish that has ONE SOUND.

Get real.


Mike T.

Whilst I won’t be buying an XF for my own reasons (I love my vintage Yamaha gear more and the XF doesn’t offer anything over their capabilities for me IMHO :-) ), I have a £200 Line 6 Variax 500 guitar with 20 odd guitar models in it, and that’s before you start processing the sound though my £300 Line 6 X3 Live. So that’s a tad more than one sound. :-)