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Viewing topic "Curiosity!"

     
Posted on: June 26, 2009 @ 09:48 PM
motif8mine
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So,
I uninstalled the AI Driver and Cubase AI 4 and installed the YSFW in their place… and, I’m not quite sure whether it has messed things up or corrected them but, now the mLAN Monitor Setup ‘with PC’ and ‘with PC (DirectMonitor)’ are now functioning totally opposite the way they did before…

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Posted on: June 28, 2009 @ 02:19 PM
Bad_Mister
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Motif XS mLAN Monitor Setup

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Posted on: June 29, 2009 @ 03:58 PM
motif8mine
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Thanks, what I am referring to is the fact that initially, setting the mLAN Monitor setting to ‘with PC’ allowed me to monitor both Logic Pro 8 and the XS but any record enabled audio track would not be heard. Additionally, while in the ‘with PC (DirectMonitor)’ setting, the XS could only be heard when I created Audio Tracks, routing the mLAN outs to the Audio Track Input buss…

So, in order to record and monitor the XS Audio, it was necessary to switch that setting to ‘with PC (DirectMonitor)’. Now, those settings are reversed. I cannot hear the XS in the ‘with PC’ setting unless I create audio tracks and record enable them. Likewise, in the ‘with PC (DirectMonitor)’ I can now monitor both the XS and Logic but, any record enabled audio track will not be heard…

Maybe this is the result of updating the XS to OS 1.5.1 last week…

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Posted on: June 29, 2009 @ 05:49 PM
Bad_Mister
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I don’t think so.

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Posted on: June 29, 2009 @ 07:08 PM
Dreamflight
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Judging from some logic I’ve seen in these parts recently, it could be that OS 1.51 is the cause of global warming too.

-sigh-

Df.

PS: motif8mine - this is not a response to something specific you wrote in your post.

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Posted on: June 29, 2009 @ 10:12 PM
motif8mine
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PS: motif8mine - this is not a response to something specific you wrote in your post.

No problem. The only things that have changed in my setup in the last week are:

1) I updated the OS in the XS…
2) I uninstalled and reinstalled the Yamaha USB MIDI Driver…
3) I deleted the AI Driver and installed the YSFW in its place…
4) I uninstalled Cubase AI 4.5.2

The only thing that has changed in my Macbook Pro is that I upgraded to Safari 4…

It took me over an hour to figure out what was wrong since the ‘with PC’ setting is loaded when I boot the XS from my .XOA (AutoLoad file). When I wasn’t hearing the XS while operating the DAW, I never thought to check that setting…

Anyway, the Yamaha Support Tech called back today. He explained that the way things are functioning now is the way the are supposed to function and that I should just keep the XS in ‘with PC (DirectMonitor)’ mode when using mLAN… and, that there’s no real need to use the ‘with PC’ setting. So, I guess I’ll just go with that…

It’s still rather curious… Peace…

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Posted on: June 30, 2009 @ 12:22 PM
Bad_Mister
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there’s no real need to use the ‘with PC’ setting. So, I guess I’ll just go with that…

There is certainly a use for the “with PC” option. And I guess it really is one of those things that you don’t really appreciate it until you actually need it.

The stand alone option is obvious… it is for when you are using the Motif XS without a computer.

The with PC is for when you are transferring data between sequencers - it comes down to interrupting the normal audio path between the XS tone engine and the analog audio outputs. Here’s what I mean: Normally when you playback a MIDI sequence in the XS sequencer or send the MIDI data into the XS from an external sequencer, the MIDI data triggers the XS tone generator which creates “audio” that is sent directly to the analog L/R output.

When you are going to be recording that audio back to your DAW (software sequencer), this is when the “with PC” option becomes absolutely necessary. In this situation you want the MIDI track to trigger the XS tone engine and you want the audio to travel via Firewire to your DAW (where you will record it to audio tracks). If the signal is also going to the analog L/R output as normal - you will hear “doubling”.

You will hear the normal direct output of signal, first and then you will hear the audio as it is routed through your DAW!!! The signal going through the DAW will be a few milliseconds later (according to the latency of your system).

The signals can be quite different… what if you want to process the audio with a VST Effect in your computer… you do not want to hear the normal direct signal (because it is not processed by your VST Effect...) you want to hear ONLY the signal that has been routed THROUGH your DAW - that is the purpose of “With PC”

Finally, With PC (Direct Monitoring)is the same as “with PC” with the following difference: at no time in the explanation above did we mention you playing the XS “live” - it was all about transferring (pre-recorded) data MIDI to audio… But there is a scenario where you want to monitor tracks you have already recorded in your DAW and you want to play on the XS “live”.... you do not want and you don’t have to (thankfully) deal with the extra milliseconds of delay it will take to run through the DAW. This is because your live playing will be routed “Direct” to the analog outputs for monitoring purposes… so you are overdubbing to already recorded tracks and hearing your actually playing “live” direct - thus the name “with PC + with Direct Monitoring”. The signal you are playing “live” will be heard direct only, not through the DAW!

Hope that helps.

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Posted on: June 30, 2009 @ 04:38 PM
motif8mine
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There is certainly a use for the “with PC” option.

Bad_Mister,
thanks for the reply. I was quoting the conversation I had with the Support person in California. I thought I had a very good handle on these settings until that conversation, which kind of muddied the water. :)

They are clearing up again…

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Posted on: July 01, 2009 @ 12:06 PM
motif8mine
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UPDATE!
I find that I have misrepresented my problem. Since, I could not hear the XS audio until I switched the setting to ‘DirectMonitor’, I assumed that those settings are reversed. They Are Not!

The ‘with PC’ setting allows me only to hear the DAW software instruments… I cannot hear audio from the XS at all, unless I turn on the DAW’s software monitoring- (something I never had to do before...)

I don’t know if the best course of action is to reinstall the OS, the FW driver or the AI driver. I don’t recall noticing any problems until after the switching drivers. I have no clue as to why that would affect how the XS and DAW interact with this setting…

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Posted on: July 01, 2009 @ 02:03 PM
Bad_Mister
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The ‘with PC’ setting allows me only to hear the DAW software instruments… I cannot hear audio from the XS at all, unless I turn on the DAW’s software monitoring- (something I never had to do before...)

That is correct. And is working exactly as it should. The ‘With PC’ function disconnects the Motif XS engine from going directly to the analog outputs (always has)… this means you must monitor through your DAW (this is correct!!!!!) The reason is so that you can hear the processing you are doing to audio signals routed to your DAW!

I content that you just never noticed it before
-- or --
Is you are afraid to do something you never had to do before? I don’t understand.

Do you understand the explanation and reason for the modes: Stand alone, with PC, with PC(Direct Monitor)?

Perhaps not?

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Posted on: July 01, 2009 @ 03:43 PM
MoGut
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Bad_Mister - 01 July 2009 02:03 PM

And is working exactly as it should. The ‘With PC’ function disconnects the Motif XS engine from going directly to the analog outputs (always has)… this means you must monitor through your DAW (this is correct!!!!!) The reason is so that you can hear the processing you are doing to audio signals routed to your DAW!

Isnt it supposed to finally route the audio BACK to XS analog outputs AFTER the daw for monitoring tho? If set to do so?

My problem is before that even. I cant seem to get audio signal showing up in Cubase period ‘with PC direct monitor’ or “with pc”. I will be posting a formal question soon if i cant figure this out.

I followed this article closely, to no avail… im still struggling, it looks fairly simple

http://www.motifator.com/index.php/support/view/advanced_application_mlan_audio_setup_tutorial

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Posted on: July 01, 2009 @ 04:47 PM
motif8mine
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this means you must monitor through your DAW (this is correct!!!!!) The reason is so that you can hear the processing you are doing to audio signals routed to your DAW!

I content that you just never noticed it before—or—Is you are afraid to do something you never had to do before? I don’t understand.

Do you understand the explanation and reason for the modes: Stand alone, with PC, with PC(Direct Monitor)

Again, thanks for your help. It’s not a matter of not noticing it before because 85% of the work I did in Logic was in the ‘with PC’ mode and I never had to address this setting in Logic 8. Neither is it a case of not understanding, or better, I understood the concepts based upon how they worked in my setup prior to this week…

And, certainly it’s not a case of fearing to do something I’ve never done. Simply, in the approximately 21 or so months that I have been using the XS and Logic, (I bought them the same week, (but, I believe it was at least a few months later that the leopard driver was released to support mLAN), I’ve never done this, period.

So, if this is the correct way it should function, great! I’ll adjust my thinking accordingly- things are reversed and there a setting to address in Logic… I was simply trying to figure out why that was not the case for the hundreds of times I’ve used these two before this week… And, I guess the response to my original post is that it indeed has corrected things...

Peace…

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Posted on: September 11, 2009 @ 12:03 PM
motif8mine
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Reviving a long dead post:

First, the XS Settings: Using the YSFW series…
[Utility]>[F1] General>[SF4] - Autoload>IEEE1394 Driver = FW>Stored
[Utility]>[F5] Control>[SF1] Remote>Logic
[Utility]>[F5] Control>[SF2] MIDI>Interface>mLAN

Logic Pro 9 Settings:
Output Device= Yamaha Steinberg FW;
Input Device= Yamaha Steinberg FW
Software Monitor=off

Now the new problem: when using LogicPro 9, the XS can be heard regardless of the mLAN Monitor Setting. That is, it doesn’t matter if it is in ‘Stand Alone, ‘with PC’ or ‘with PC DirectMonitor’. Does anyone else have this issue or can suggest a remedy?

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