Old Motifator threads are available in the Archive.
Kimmo
Total Posts: 17
Joined 08-18-2007 status: Regular |
Now that the old threads are in archive I can’t resort to them to see the final opinion on this, but here goes (again): Please, dear Yamaha, provide the Motif XS with a tap tempo button. It doesn’t matter which one it’ll be. I play most of my gigs standing up, and trying to tap tempo with the appropriate pedal is occasionally impossible because I’m using my other foot to hold down other pedals, sustain/hold being the most frequently used one. The other, well, I use for standing. Based on my experience I really would need a simple button somewhere on my dashboard to adjust the internal tempo when the playing gets carried away. I won’t mention the good uses overall that there would be for a tap tempo button, because I believe we all recognize those all too well. My secondary keyboard is Nord Stage 88, and I’m constantly adjusting the delay effect with the tap tempo button. On my Motif I’ve got a 1000x more huge array of tempo-bound features, complex delays, arpeggios, oscillators to name a few, but a simple means to syncing them to other players in a live setting is.. Well, IMO it’s missing. Yamaha digital mixers have it and I had it in my old Korg is40 arranger keyboard :) It’s too simple not to be there. I know the pedal is convenient, but it should be “a convenient alternative” and not a mandatory requirement. I mean, I would most definitely have use for both methods! People would still have use for the pedal too. Dear BadMister, do you think implementing a tap tempo feature to one of the existing, LED-equipped buttons on the Motif’s dashboard is something Yamaha could provide in future updates? |
shinenz
Total Posts: 31
Joined 03-03-2009 status: Regular |
I agree, I am getting the xs this week and would really love this function however I’m gonna buy an mpd32 which has tap tempo plus I get to use the pads for sample triggering so kills two birds with one stone, otherwise it was going to be a fantom g6 but i’m sure I’ll be happy with the xs. |
Kimmo
Total Posts: 17
Joined 08-18-2007 status: Regular |
At last! Thanks for the reply..! I was afraid my comment went completely unnoticed :) To someone at Yamaha (if you happen to read this): Please give a some kind of a definite answer to this and let’s bury this subject once and for all. And let’s make it sticky so nobody has to ask again. On a side note..
Someone give me the blueprints for the Yamaha Tap Tempo pedal and I’ll hack it to a large, friendly, RED button on the dashboard! :D
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Kimmo
Total Posts: 17
Joined 08-18-2007 status: Regular |
It seems there’s a tap tempo related thread growing strong here too:
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bsmart
Total Posts: 225
Joined 01-12-2005 status: Enthusiast |
I think that one problem with these threads is that the people at Yamaha might be misunderstanding what we want. The tap tempo pedal looks like a great tool for keeping your Motif in sync with other live musicians. However, what I want tap tempo for is in situations where I want to set the tempo for something that I’m about to be able to record. I don’t want to constantly change it. For example, if I’m about to play in the first phrase of a new pattern, I’ll probably already have the phrase in my head. I can hear it in my head just like i want it to sound. I’ll find a voice that is close to what I want, set the phrase length and other record options the way I want, but how will I set the tempo? 1. Arrow to the tempo control on the display and guess at a close tempo. “Hmmmm. Maybe 84 BPM will work?” 2. Maybe I hit record, switch the knobs to control the arp and use knob 8 to control tempo. This has better feel, since I can hear the metronome clicking off the tempo, but the knob is so sensitive that it is difficult to do much except get the tempo close to what I want. Here is what would satisfy me. If I arrow to the tempo setting on the screen, I can, instead of typing in a number, tap the enter key in time with the tempo that I want. So, in the example above, I’d just listen to the loop in my head, and tap my finger along with the phrase in my head for a few beats. Then, I’d be set. I realize that this wouldn’t be a good tool for performing live. That’s fine. If I want to do this live, I’ll get the pedal. Most every PC sequencer that I’ve used has had a function like this, even back to DOS days. I’m sure that this type of tap tempo would be a piece of cake for the experts in Japan to put together. I’d even be absolutely content if it didn’t work during playback or record. Am I way off base, or do many of you in this thread simply want this sort of tap tempo function, and not the live sync one that is offered by the 3/4 pedal? |
maymanuel1
Total Posts: 43
Joined 03-26-2008 status: Regular |
A tap tempo would work for all situations.. Live/Rehearsals/Recording.. In live settings, you wouldn’t require the use of both feet, one to control your damper/volume pedals and the other the tap tempo(unless you play sitting down).. You would also be able to accommodate the pulses/arpeggios/fx’s on the fly.. In rehearsals, you can have control of the tempo, and always prove that your musicians need to practice more often with the metronome on.. (The drummer can finally realize he was wrong this whole time) haha.. In recording, I agree with bsmart, you sometimes have that phrase that sounds good in your mind.. but by the time you find the appropriate sound, fix the tempo manually.. you will most likely not remember the phrase exactly. These are just some of the things you could do instantly with the addition of tap tempo.. |
Synthgeek
Total Posts: 668
Joined 11-18-2003 status: Guru |
+1 All good reasons for quick tap tempo. I hate fumbling around to find tempo only to loose my idea. This simple request shortens the gap between an idea and getting it into the XS. So simple yet so crucial. |
uli_p
Total Posts: 53
Joined 03-02-2007 status: Experienced |
+1 |
lpr
Total Posts: 76
Joined 06-13-2009 status: Experienced |
Man, such simple function… Where is it? Maybe on a Roland Fantom G perhaps? |
Bad_Mister
Total Posts: 36620
Joined 07-30-2002 status: Moderator |
S90 XS/S70 XS |
uncaduncad
Total Posts: 568
Joined 01-13-2004 status: Guru |
? No, no! On the XS? We know it’s on those! :) And if it’s on those, it can definately be put on the MO XS.. |
christiaan
Total Posts: 9
Joined 02-03-2006 status: Newcomer |
Hi All.
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Bad_Mister
Total Posts: 36620
Joined 07-30-2002 status: Moderator |
Then you simply will have to be patient. |
darkstar_outcast
Total Posts: 250
Joined 02-20-2008 status: Enthusiast |
Tap tempo is very useful,so please people at Yamaha,have this in future system update… In my humble opinion,this should be there from the very first version ... I am playing live with 12 musicians,and we are not playing on clicks,everything is “live”. So,I can’t guess tempo of songs before gig.Tap tempo would be just great feature !
Thanks for listening,
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Bad_Mister
Total Posts: 36620
Joined 07-30-2002 status: Moderator |
You will just have to be patient… I believe it is still on the list of things to come (we’ll just have to wait and see)… but I’m curious… perhaps you can answer a question for me Question: Have you ever used TAP TEMPO to put a sequence or Arpeggio back into tempo with “live” musicians? How does that work for you? I bet it is NOT COOL!!! Suggestion: You can route any drum or group of drum instruments from a USER DRUM Kit to the assignable outputs. If you are on stage and are using the arpeggiators and/or the sequencer to enhance a band’s live performing experience, I highly recommend that you create a percussion part that you can output to the assignable outputs and feed to your on-stage monitors. If you do not have on stage monitors, then you probably are not ready to really be using the technology to enhance your performing experience! (IMO)… Anytime any, let’s call it, “technology”, (because it could be an arpeggiator, a sequencer, a tape, or a computer playing back additional parts) well, any time ‘technology’ is used, you really want to be able to hear it and play along to it - because adjusting to it is easy… adjusting it to you, is simply bogus - and bound to be dodgy at best. When you edit a USER DRUM Kit you can route all the necessary instruments for this “percussion part” to the “asL” and “asR” - you don’t even need to record the data on a separate track, because any drum KEYS routed to the assignable outputs are automatically taken out of the main mix… so isolation is guaranteed. Feed the assignable outputs to your mixer and then to your band’s on-stage monitor system.
This is done on pro tours all over the world. Why?
2) a percussion groove (can be congas, or bongos, just a shaker, or it can be any manner of a percussive sounds that groove in the context of your particular song… I usually let the drummer program it because they have a great sense of what they want to play along with - because it should be complementary)… a percussion groove is so much more musical to play along with and it removes that nervous, tentative feel you get when playing with a click. You can actually relax and let the music happen… but hearing it is critical. Plus the benefit of having something musically contextual, is that if it is heard by those in the front row, close to the stage, it fits better than “Click - Click - Click” - in the quiet spots everyone hears it… The Drum machine groove you hear in the opening of the Phil Collins (classic) “In the Air Tonight” was originally programmed so that while he was singing the long intro he had something to keep the feel for him… he knew that later he would have that big drum flam-a-diddle introduction so he programmed that little 808 (or 909) drum groove so that he could maintain the proper ‘feel’ while singing the acappella… But after listening back to it - it was so very musical they left it in… That is the idea, anyway. As to “tap tempo”, I’d hate to see the poor keyboard player trying desparately to get the arpeggio pattern back in beat by TAPPING on a button on the front panel - that is absurd and I bet it is stressful and causes for some nervous, tentative music. While there are many good reasons to have TAP TEMPO, getting the ‘technology’ back into step with the band is NOT one of them. If your band is not going to listen to, or cannot hear the arpeggio or sequence data, then you should not be using it. It cannot adjust to YOU; you are the human beings and have to adjust to it… because YOU CAN… IT cannot adjust to you. And if you think you can tap tempo the arpeggio or sequence back into step with your band… I’d like to see it… just my two and half cents. Tap tempo has a good use in starting a song… if/when you don’t know the tempo. Having been a musician for so many years, and having been a recording engineer during the 1970’s and 1980’s, tempos (in BPM) are something that you simply carry with you. If you are sequencing songs or using arpeggios tempo is automatically memorized by the technology. Let me know, I’m curious. |
darkstar_outcast
Total Posts: 250
Joined 02-20-2008 status: Enthusiast |
Hello, Well,I don’t need tap tempo for apregios,and I completely agree with you - I saw too many times keyboardist trying to play arpeggio with tap tempo,and it NEVER sound right. About click and percussion - great to share that info with us ! To be honest,I played on “click” with band couple of times,and it is just like you said - nervous playing.I must try that percussion-groove thing. Thanks bad mister ! I need tap tempo for effects.I play in one reggae band,and we have many many dub parts,so I need many time-related effects.And then it can be great to have those effects in sync ! And tap tempo can be great for that. Bad_Mister,as music professional,I think it would be great value for us if you can share some secrets from live touring with us. For example,can you give us live setup from keyboardist point of view.I planned to buy 01v mixer for mixing keyboards live (we have 2 man-4 keyboards setup in our band).Can you give us sight what people all over the world do in their live setups? Thanks ! |