In this thread: http://www.motifator.com/index.php/forum/viewthread/479194/ I asked how I can convert voices/performances from my XS8 to a MOXF.  The suggestion was to use the John Melas total librarian.  But I can’t see how this is supposed to work.

I downloaded the DEMO versions of the Melas software for both the XS and the MOXF. 

I can import from my XS8 to the Total Librarian. 

But what I can’t see is any way to re-save the data in MOXF format.  The ONLY save or save as options are for Total Librarian format. 

I thought I could import from the XS, then using the MOXF total librarian, import whatever I had off the XS, then save it out in MOXF format, thus converting it.  But I can see no way to do that.

From what I can see, the only limitation in DEMO mode is you can’t Export directly from the software into the keyboard.  Well, i don’t really need to do that if I can create what I want on the XS, have that imported to the XS Total Library, saved, then imported to the MOXF Total Library, and then resaved in MOXF format (X3A, I believe, for example), then copy that file to jump drive, and import off the jump drive into the MOXF.

But, I don’t see any way to save the file in X3A format, or any other MOXF compatible format.  What am I missing?  The manual says you can convert, but it really doesn’t say HOW to convert. 
The only time the word convert is in the manual on page one where it says: “Reads (and converts) Voices, Drum Kits, Performances, Mixes and Masters from all native XF/XS series files
o Motif XF: X3A, X3V
o MOXF: X6A, X6V
o Motif XS: X0A, X0V, X0E
o Motif Rack XS: X1E
o S90 XS/S70 XS: X2A, X2V
o MOX: X4A, X4V
o MX49/MX61: X5A”

Well that doesn’t tell me HOW to make the conversion, unless it means converts all those formats to Total Lbrarian.  But that’s not what I understood it to mean. 

So, is converting one format to another a limitation not allowed in DEMO mode?  Because that’s not what the limitation alert indicated.  I’m back to square one: HOW do I convert any XS data to MOXF compatibility so that I can import to MOXF off a jump drive?  If anyone has done this, I sure would like to see a step by step.  Thank you

Donald-M - 28 September 2017 02:16 PM

So, is converting one format to another a limitation not allowed in DEMO mode?  Because that’s not what the limitation alert indicated.  I’m back to square one: HOW do I convert any XS data to MOXF compatibility so that I can import to MOXF off a jump drive?  If anyone has done this, I sure would like to see a step by step.  Thank you

You might want to reread my third post in the thread you referred to, in which I said (emphasis added):
“I suggest that you download the Melas Waveform Editor demo, install it on your computer, and read at least the first several pages of the manual.”

If you like what you see, you’ll of course have to purchase the product for it to actually save files.

Both cmayhle and philwoodmusic posted information concerning what would be necessary to do if the Total Librarian was used.

5pinDIN - 28 September 2017 02:55 PM

Donald-M - 28 September 2017 02:16 PM

So, is converting one format to another a limitation not allowed in DEMO mode?  Because that’s not what the limitation alert indicated.  I’m back to square one: HOW do I convert any XS data to MOXF compatibility so that I can import to MOXF off a jump drive?  If anyone has done this, I sure would like to see a step by step.  Thank you

You might want to reread my third post in the thread you referred to, in which I said (emphasis added):
“I suggest that you download the Melas Waveform Editor demo, install it on your computer, and read at least the first several pages of the manual.”

If you like what you see, you’ll of course have to purchase the product for it to actually save files.

Both cmayhle and philwoodmusic posted information concerning what would be necessary to do if the Total Librarian was used.

Sorry, I should have mentioned that I also looked at the Waveform Editor, and read through the first several pages of the manual as you had suggested. While it says at the top you can use the WE to convert between the various formats, it doesn’t say HOW. It says: “ï‚· Import MOXF File
This is the command that actually makes MOXF files editable on the Motif Waveform Editor. Create a new Motif XF file and then use this command to import and convert User Voices and User Waveforms from a MOXF file. Save the results (Motif XF format) and load it to the MOXF! Please note that the MOXF can only load Motif XF files (not Motif XS), that’s why you must create a Motif XF file for the import. Of course, Motif XS users can create a Motif XS file instead, to import MOXF Voices and Waveforms to the Motif XS!” This is what is frustrating to me.  The first thing in the manual says you can import and convert voices among the XF, MOXF and XS files.  But the import description seems to indicate you can ONLY import MOXF/XF files NOT XS files. It seems to indicate you can convert XF/MOXF files to the XS—the exact opposite of what I need to be able to do! 

Sorry to be so dense here, but I still don’t see how this is supposed to work.  And until that’s clear to me, I am not going to spend any money to buy the software until I know for sure that it will do what I need to do. 

What I need is to be able to:

1. Create a voice on my XS (or a bunch of them) I normally use the XS Editor for that
2.  Save those voices as either an X0A or X0V file on a jump drive. 
3.  Import the X0A or X0V to Waveform editor (or the Total Libriarian) and re-save in X3A or X3V format on my PC, and save on the jump drive
4. Plug the jump drive in the MOXF at church, and import the voices there.

From what I can tell from the Total Librarian description (and the suggestions from Phil Wood and Cmayblet, I’d have to use a computer USB connection to make the import.  Well, that may not be an option for bunch of reasons.  That’s why I need the jump drive option.  So, I’m left confused as to A)which Melas software I’m supposed to even use and B)knowing whether or not it will actually work! 

I’m a bit surprised that the manual for the WE doesn’t spell out HOW to do a format conversion from, say, XOA to X3A.  Even where it describes “Save As”, it doesn’t say a thing about what format options you have to save in.  It does say that in creating a NEW project, you can choose what type of file and all the XF, XS files seem to be there.  But not for the SAVE function.  And since that function is disabled in DEMO mode, there’s no way I can know or see that it WILL save one to the other!  So, does it? 

I appreciate the help, but I hope you can understand why I’m confused!

On a sidenote - I’m also a bit surprised that it doesn’t seem to have occurred to anyone at Yamaha that their many thousands of Motif ES and XS users might want to be able to convert and import some of the many sounds they created for those keyboards over the years.  It would have been nice if Yamaha had provided some kind of conversion package themselves for that! Couldn’t have been that difficult to pull off.  Maybe allow the XF editor to import XS voices that can be re-saved in XF format.  It is frustrating it has to be this difficult.

In the Total Librarian scenario, the conversion is first from XS to Total Librarian, and second from Total Librarian to MOXF, the second conversion happening via transmit from computer to machine:

“To convert using Total Librarian: (converts Voices, Drum Kits, Performances, Songs, Patterns, Masters)

Create a new Total Library file (File->New Total Library)
Import your XS file (File->Import Native File)
Transmit to the synth (Edit->Transmit all)”

In the Waveform Editor scenario, using the Melas (MOXF version) Waverform Editor:

“Create a new MOXF All file (File->New)
Open your XS file (File->Open)
Copy Voices from XS file to MOXF using copy paste (drag and drop also works)
-- Dependent Waveforms will be copied automatically
Save MOXF file (File->Save)
Load to MOXF using USB memory stick!”

cmayhle - 28 September 2017 04:22 PM

In the Total Librarian scenario, the conversion is first from XS to Total Librarian, and second from Total Librarian to MOXF, the second conversion happening via transmit from computer to machine:

“To convert using Total Librarian: (converts Voices, Drum Kits, Performances, Songs, Patterns, Masters)

Create a new Total Library file (File->New Total Library)
Import your XS file (File->Import Native File)
Transmit to the synth (Edit->Transmit all)”

In the Waveform Editor scenario, using the Melas (MOXF version) Waverform Editor:

“Create a new MOXF All file (File->New)
Open your XS file (File->Open)
Copy Voices from XS file to MOXF using copy paste (drag and drop also works)
-- Dependent Waveforms will be copied automatically
Save MOXF file (File->Save)
Load to MOXF using USB memory stick!”

I understand this.  But what I want to be clear on is that when you save, it is saving automatically as X3A format?

In checking a bit further, I see that you can import XS files into the XF Editor.  And, I know on the Motif, you can load an X0E file (editor file).  So, would it not be possible to load, say, an X0V file into the XF Editor, and then save an X3E and then load that into the MOXF?  Wouldn’t that do the job, or does the MOXF not read X3E files?

Donald-M - 28 September 2017 04:53 PM

In checking a bit further, I see that you can import XS files into the XF Editor.  And, I know on the Motif, you can load an X0E file (editor file).  So, would it not be possible to load, say, an X0V file into the XF Editor, and then save an X3E and then load that into the MOXF?  Wouldn’t that do the job, or does the MOXF not read X3E files?

This Thread should be helpful for the above question, especially the discussion by 5pinDIN.

cmayhle - 28 September 2017 07:23 PM

Donald-M - 28 September 2017 04:53 PM

In checking a bit further, I see that you can import XS files into the XF Editor.  And, I know on the Motif, you can load an X0E file (editor file).  So, would it not be possible to load, say, an X0V file into the XF Editor, and then save an X3E and then load that into the MOXF?  Wouldn’t that do the job, or does the MOXF not read X3E files?

This Thread should be helpful for the above question, especially the discussion by 5pinDIN.

Well, I did find out tonight.  I made an X3E file by importing the X0E file I made in the Motif XS Editor into the XF editor.  Copied it to a jump drive, but discovered when I got to the church where the MOXF is, it does not see or read X3E files.  There’s no editor option for import to the keyboard. 

The real shortcoming in all this is Yamaha not upgrading their editor software for either the XS or the XF to allow for conversion from one to the other.  At the very least, allowing you to save a file from the editor in “ALL VOICE” mode (X0V for the XS, say), and import to the XF Editor, save as X3E, then that can be imported to the MOXF.  That the editor allows multiple format imports but only ONE format for saving boggles my mind!  That Yamaha, a multibillion dollar corporation, couldn’t hire someone internally to write a simple file conversion program is also mind boggling to me.  Melas software seems good for its purpose, but he offers little support and there’s no direct conversion with that either.  It is, in my view, a real failure on the part of Yamaha to not make this easier, given they have thousands upon thousands of users around the world.  Why make it so difficult to convert files?  Ugh!!!

Anyway, thank you for all the replies, it has helped me grasp this puppy a bit better.  Though, I still have to figure out the best way to handle all this.

I meant to add above that the church let me bring the MOXF home with me, so at least I can figure all this out right here in my home studio!  But, once its back there, it’ll stay there.  This is a one time only offer.