Hi

I’ve searched the manuals and dug around in the editor, but failed to find a way to modulate this.
I’m pretty happy with the vocal/formant sound I’ve gotten out of the MoXF using this filter, and of course, a LFO modulating cutoff frequency/ies brings some life to it too.
I would love to also be able to slightly modulate the distance between the filters though, is that at all possible?

Thanks in advance!

zpink - 24 September 2019 04:02 PM

Hi

I’ve searched the manuals and dug around in the editor, but failed to find a way to modulate this.
I’m pretty happy with the vocal/formant sound I’ve gotten out of the MoXF using this filter, and of course, a LFO modulating cutoff frequency/ies brings some life to it too.
I would love to also be able to slightly modulate the distance between the filters though, is that at all possible?

Thanks in advance!

Without knowing exactly what kind of modulation you’re going for,
(filter sweep maybe), its tough to be specific.

But say you’re only interested in modulating between 2 or 3 values of the distance parameter of the DualBPF.  You could create a voice that had identical elements with each assigned a DualBPF with the different distance values you’re going for and then use the controllers to modulate the element levels which indirectly is allowing you to modulate the Distance. Since the only difference between the Elements is the DualBPF distance.  But depending on what you’re going for this may or may not get you there. 

You could also take those same elements give them each there own DualBPF with different Distances but and give them different filter envelopes and then modulate the FEG with the assigned controller.

Or you could use the Dynamic Filter that is part of the TECH effects and set it up to give you A filter to modulate against another element that is assigned a DualBPF filter by assigning the Dynamic filter to one or more of the elements and the DualBPF filter to one or more of the elements, and mixing and matching between FEG, and controlling the Dynamic Filter with some assigned controller.

Indirectly manipulating the distance parameter by using identical elements with different distances, or indirectly manipulating the distance by modulating the FEG through an assigned controller.  These are round about ways, but might get you there.

The modulation target is the subject of this thread, I thought that was clear so my bad on that one.
As modulation source I would now be happy with anything as I currently can’t find any. Ideally it should of course be a repeating one but even the mod wheel would do for now.
It’s not a biggie since I have other gear where I can use two filters with the frequencies modulated so that they drift slightly apart.
This filter in AWM2 sounds very nice IMHO and it’s easy to play around passing different waveforms through it, but I guess we can’t have it all!

Unless of course, someone else know how this can be done. :-)

zpink - 25 September 2019 04:04 AM

The modulation target is the subject of this thread, I thought that was clear so my bad on that one.
As modulation source I would now be happy with anything as I currently can’t find any. Ideally it should of course be a repeating one but even the mod wheel would do for now.
It’s not a biggie since I have other gear where I can use two filters with the frequencies modulated so that they drift slightly apart.
This filter in AWM2 sounds very nice IMHO and it’s easy to play around passing different waveforms through it, but I guess we can’t have it all!

Unless of course, someone else know how this can be done. :-)

The DualBPF is two BPFs in parallel.  The Distance parameter allows you to set the Cutoff of the second BPF.

In your voice if you just use a BPF on more than one element.  And the elements have the same filter envelope but different cutoffs.  You can assign the cutoffs of each element to controllers and modulate those cutoffs directly as targets.  It should give you the same effect as if you modulate the distance parameter on a DualBPF

To Test:

Setup a voice with only two identical elements.  Give each element a BPF.
Make sure the FEG is the same for both elements.
Give Each BPF a different cutoff ( or whatever you had in mind for the DualBPF )
Set a Controller for the Cutoff to one or both of the BPFs in the CTLSET

Moving that controller will definitely modulate the distances between those two parallel BPFs.

From my current understanding of Motif’s AWM2 synth, the DualBPF is a convenience, the same effect can be had by using two or more elements with BPFs and their cutoffs set to different values .  The cutoffs can be controlled as targets.

Now of course if you don’t have two elements, or if all of your elements have other filters and you need to try to accomplish it with one element and a Dual BPF, then you have to realize that you can modulate the Cutoff of the first BPF directly as a destination.  Now when you modulate that cutoff point what do you think will happen to the other cutoff point (which is represented by the distance parameter?) Does it stay where it is as the first cutoff is moving?  Does it move some relative amount to the first one?

So although you cannot set DualBPF Distance as a Destination of a Controller, If you realize that Distance is actually setting the Cutoff of the second BPF, and you know that you can assign the Cutoff of the first BPF to a controller, then you can modulate the distances between these cutoffs by Modulating the cutoff of the first BPF.  Also setting the Cutoff Key Follow parameter in this situation might give you what you’re looking for.

Does this make sense?

Hi
I know how this works, all I was after was to find a simple way of modulating the distance between the two cutoffs.
Thanks anyway

zpink - 26 September 2019 01:27 AM

Hi
I know how this works, all I was after was to find a simple way of modulating the distance between the two cutoffs.
Thanks anyway

Okay,., I see.  That is after all the challenge (To keep things Simple)

But because these flagships have hundreds of parameters that allow the musician to intricately contour sound, it would be impossible to make the process of changing every single parameter “simple” notwithstanding that “simple” is a relative term.  And the synth manufacturers can’t always anticipate which parameters to elevate (assign to a knob, button, or fader), and which parameters to assign to lower levels of access.  So its tricky.

I do now understand that you want to be able to “simply” and dynamically control the distance parameter of the DualBPF.  I was just trying to clarify that it could be (with some effort) modulated on the Motif.  The workflow involved with changing any given synth parameter is the quintessential moving target because one person’s easy or simple workflow is another person’s nightmare LOL.

I don’t know what’s possible on Montage, maybe the Distance Parameter of the DualBPF is directly addressable by the Super Knob ;-)