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Viewing topic "CP1: how to set up an expression pedal separated from the internal sound of the piano"

   
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Posted on: May 23, 2014 @ 05:56 AM
rome
Total Posts:  6
Joined  05-23-2014
status: Newcomer

hi,
I ask for help to set the expression pedal to external expander (zone 3 in performance) that removes only the volume of sound expander and not to the CP1.

I can not separate the two sounds when I turn down the sound expander also lowers the sound of the piano.

In the performance I put in “OFF” the FC controls in zone 1 and 2 and in “ON” the zone 3 (external expander)

In Utility I have assigned to FC1 or 2 Expression or Volume
In Common FC1 oe 2 to OFF

thanks for the help

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Posted on: May 24, 2014 @ 05:00 AM
rome
Total Posts:  6
Joined  05-23-2014
status: Newcomer

hi,

for us this is a BUG????

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Posted on: May 24, 2014 @ 06:25 AM
Bad_Mister
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Could be… Try contacting your regional Yamaha. Don’t have one here at the moment to verify your findings.

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Posted on: May 24, 2014 @ 08:24 AM
digitalperformer7
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Bad_Mister - 24 May 2014 06:25 AM

Could be… Try contacting your regional Yamaha. Don’t have one here at the moment to verify your findings.

Dear Bad_Mister
I’m sorry to say that Yamaha Italy don’t measure up with other regional ones in the world. :(
Worst is they don’t reply to technical questions neither by phone or mail.

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Posted on: May 24, 2014 @ 11:04 AM
Bad_Mister
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I can double check, but its a long holiday weekend here in the US so it will have to wait at least until next Tuesday, the earliest. Sorry.

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Posted on: May 24, 2014 @ 02:22 PM
rome
Total Posts:  6
Joined  05-23-2014
status: Newcomer

confirm what digitalperformer7 says !

I wrote to Yamaha Italy but I did not answer

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Posted on: May 25, 2014 @ 07:34 AM
digitalperformer7
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Bad_Mister - 24 May 2014 11:04 AM

I can double check, but its a long holiday weekend here in the US so it will have to wait at least until next Tuesday, the earliest. Sorry.

Very kind of yours, Bad_Mister, we owe you a debt of gratitude.
Knowing the answer within a week or two doesn’t matter, afterall. What really matters most for rome is knowing for sure if controlling external volumes is feasible with CP1 masterkeyboard capabilities.

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Posted on: May 27, 2014 @ 06:49 AM
digitalperformer7
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Bad_Mister
This morning I reached a grest music store out of my local area (just one hour by car) to buy a new pair of headphones and a headphone amplifier. Looking into the keyboard department, I saw a CP1!
Thus I Asked to the salesperson to help me accomplishing my goal: hunting that nasty bug.
He was very helpful and collaborative giving me everything I needed: FC7, a synthesizer and a MIDI cable.
He also informed me that CP1’ firmware was never upgraded.

First of all I hooked the FC7 to FC1, connected the CP1 MIDI. OUT to the synth MIDI IN and set the synthesizer to MIDI channel 3.

Then I selected the first Performance from Ext bank, pressed the [COMMON] button, Turned Knob 5 to set KbdMode to “zone” Pressed Knob 6 (ZoneEdit)
Pressed Page > until I found Page 2 Zone-specific MIDI controllers.
In this page I set everything to OFF, (midi transmit switch, FC1, FC2, modulation, sustain) EXCEPT for Zone 3.
Contrary to my expectations the external instrument was completely “deaf” to the FC7 (whether set on CC#11 or CC#7), while - although disabled - CP1 internal zone 1 was always biased by FC7!
No matter what I set, the internal zones responded always to the FC7. This is undoubtedly a bug.

Then I did another attempt: changed the CC type… To my amazement I realized that the external synthesizer responded to CC#64, 71, 72, 73 and 74 when mapped to the FC7.

This means that CP1 has a bug sending CC#11 or CC#7 to external zones and at the same time, strange but possible, the external synthesizer can’t receive neither CC#11 or CC#7.

Finally, I had a look to the release notes of CP1 firmware and none of them talk about a fixed bug similar to the one I told in this thread…
Maybe Yamaha should do something....

By the way, I’m wondering because nobody complained for this.... Do really people use their top class instruments?

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Posted on: May 27, 2014 @ 02:07 PM
stoneb3
Total Posts:  824
Joined  06-05-2011
status: Guru

I’ve not had this problem before, not sure of a bug. CP1 received 2 firmware updates the last being V1.21 released on 1/29/2013. Yamaha downloads.

From page 2 turn midi transmit switches on and under FC1 turn off zones 1 and 2. See the note on page 52 of the owners manual, transmit switches must be on in order to turn FC1 off.

What synth are you attempting to control and can you verify it’s ability to receive what you wish to send it?

Stone

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Posted on: May 27, 2014 @ 02:26 PM
Bad_Mister
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Yeah, I agree, with stoneb3… By turning the MIDI TRANSMIT SWITCH = off, you defeated the ability to transmit via MIDI.

From what you wrote I wouldn’t draw any conclusions. I cannot even report what you tried because you give no information on the device you are controlling. Plus the very first thing you state it is not current firmware. ( Yikes! )

I haven’t gotten a chance to look at it today, but I’ll take a look as soon as I can.

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Posted on: May 27, 2014 @ 09:30 PM
digitalperformer7
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stoneb3 - 27 May 2014 02:07 PM

I’ve not had this problem before, not sure of a bug. CP1 received 2 firmware updates the last being V1.21 released on 1/29/2013. Yamaha downloads.

From page 2 turn midi transmit switches on and under FC1 turn off zones 1 and 2. See the note on page 52 of the owners manual, transmit switches must be on in order to turn FC1 off.

What synth are you attempting to control and can you verify it’s ability to receive what you wish to send it?

Stone

The synthesizer I attempted to control was a Novation Mininova.
Perhaps it was due to the CP1 old firmware, but I remember to have disabled both internal zones (1 and 2) and let active just zone 3, but nothing really changed! :(
It sounds pretty strange that a recent synthesizer such as Novation Mininova is “deaf” to CC#7 and #11 only, while all the other controllers are correctly received.
As I told before, when I assigned CC#64 (sustain pedal) or CC#73 (envelope attack) the FC7 mappaed to these controllers worked flawlessly.
Assuming that I’n not the owner of this CP1, I’ll let him know about this thread development, so he can make new attempts.
Thanks
ws

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Posted on: May 28, 2014 @ 07:59 PM
stoneb3
Total Posts:  824
Joined  06-05-2011
status: Guru

The Novation Mininova does not recognize cc #7(volume). It does recognize cc #11(expression). However, to use this command you must program each patch to respond to cc #11 via the modulation matrix. A bit time consuming, but doable. The instrument does not respond to expression globally. Perhaps you may have a more suitable unit for your testing?

Stone

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Posted on: May 28, 2014 @ 09:05 PM
digitalperformer7
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stoneb3 - 28 May 2014 07:59 PM

The Novation Mininova does not recognize cc #7(volume). It does recognize cc #11(expression). However, to use this command you must program each patch to respond to cc #11 via the modulation matrix. A bit time consuming, but doable. The instrument does not respond to expression globally. Perhaps you may have a more suitable unit for your testing?

Stone

Thanks for your reply…
That’s a REAL SIGN OF LUCK :D
I was in a big music store that has a generous keyboard department and the only synthesizer salesperson gave me was a Mininova. I can’t believe it was the only synth that doesn’t receive CC#7 . It was first time I saw a Mininova…
Actually I don’t know when I’ll be back in that music store, anyway if I did, I’ll chenge synthesizer.

But the important question is:  are CP1 internal zones always affected by the FC7 when it’s used also on zone 3 and 4?
Assuming to my attemts they are, but perhaps it’s an old firmare’s fault.

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Posted on: May 29, 2014 @ 01:53 AM
rome
Total Posts:  6
Joined  05-23-2014
status: Newcomer

hi,
I would like to give my contribution.

I’m trying CP1 with Roland Fantom XR, the problem is that if we put off the “FC"controls in zones 1 and 2 ( respond to the sound generator’s internal CP1) and put ON in zones 3 or 4 (dedicated to external module); the volume pedal or expression works on ‘expanders (normal) and CP1 (error = BUG!)

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Posted on: June 03, 2014 @ 09:58 AM
digitalperformer7
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Is there any news from Bad_Mister???

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Posted on: June 03, 2014 @ 09:14 PM
stoneb3
Total Posts:  824
Joined  06-05-2011
status: Guru

Sorry for the delay, had to dig the unit out.  As I understand we have the CP1 and one external device set to receive on channel 3 and respond to volume control, via FC1 with no effect on the CP1 volume.
A performance will be edited and stored.

From common settings page 1 set keyboard mode to zone.

Zone edit screen page 2 >midi transmit, set to on for zone 3, off for zones 1 and 2.
Select FC1, set on for zone 3, off for zones 1 and 2. If you wish to add more devices and they are set to receive on channel 1 or 2 activate their respective zones (1 or 2) and controller(s) that were disabled above. Likewise for zone 4.

Continue to controller settings, fourth page. Select source FC1. Select Destinations 1 and 2, turn them off. This will disable FC1 for zones 1 and 2 in the CP1.

Store the edited performance.

Utility> set your desired midi port, USB or MIDI. You shouldn’t need to set midi channel to 3 as zone 3 in a performance by default transmits on channel 3.

Let me know if the bug is dead.

Stone

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