Korg already has 16 part combis that sound so incredibly lush, do you think their next workstation will be better than the XF?

nickmccullum808 - 24 August 2010 08:48 PM

Korg already has 16 part combis that sound so incredibly lush, do you think their next workstation will be better than the XF?

Any response to this is going to be purely hypothetical and/or subjective, including this one.

I have 4 Korg synths (Trinity/Triton/M3/Radias-R) and 4 Yamaha synths (SY85/S90/Motif ES/Motif XS) in my collection.

Korg and Yamaha synths have very different personalities. In *my* opinion, Korgs are better for shimmering delicate high frequencies, sounds that evolve over time and (in the case of the M3) certain types of drum sounds. Karma is… interestingly intriguing. The M3 also has programmable pads, and the nice ability to assign sequencer phrases to specific keys on the keyboard. The M3 also has some amazing string sounds, better than the XS to my ears.

Yamaha has a more ‘solid’ sound, beefier overall tone, superb bass sounds (that ‘Fundamental Bass’ preset is worth 20% of the cost of an XS on its own) and *much* better piano sounds as well as amazing arpeggiators. You can also use Mix mode (song or pattern) to create 16 layer pseudo-performances which are pretty close to the Korg combis in terms of complexity.

The M3 does support 16 layers per performance (or Combi, as Korg calls them) and when appropriately programmed these can sound awesome. Really, really awesome. However, do not forget that factory performances are somewhat identifiable and creating your own is non-trivial. On a Korg they are harder to create due in part to the fact that Insert FX are completely separate from voices, unlike the XS/XF where the voices and their insert FX are ‘hardcoded’ together. This is both a strength (ease of use) and a weakness (lack of flexibility getting creative with sharing insert FX across multiple parts).

I have heard a whisper that Korg will be putting something interesting out at Winter NAMM 2011. I’m hanging on to my ‘new instrument’ pennies in anticipation of that event. One thing Korg have consistently done is provide alternatives to the sample-based subtractive synthesis so prevalent today (Radias-R springs to mind as a fantastic example of this). Prior to that there was MOSS (in the Trinity Plus and the Triton). Yamaha have done great work with alternative synthesis engines (VL-1, DX cards, analogue modelling) but to be honest they seem to be moving away from these technologies and focussing on the sample-based AWM2 engine. To be fair they are extremely good at it, and features like expanded articulation are Jolly Good(tm). Yamaha arpeggiators are also top of the range, although Karma gives them a run for their money, albeit Karma is harder to ‘get into’.

Will it be better? Impossible to say. Is the M3 better than the XS? Some would say so, others wouldn’t. Same goes for Ferrari vs. Lamborghini.

Right now, if I only could have a single workstation I’d choose the XS (for the purposes of this post I’m considering the XS and the XF as essentially the same board).

Yamaha have obviously decided to go for backwards compatibility and flash in the XF. Personally, I’m not a great fan of this approach (backwards compatibility is overrated I think, and leads to compromises for the sake of legacy support, as well as the recycling of existing ROM waveforms into new products) but fair play to them for implementing it solidly. If you use a DAW for recording then I can’t really see why backward compatibility is worth pursuing.

My advice would be this. Go to a store. Try out the M3 for a bit, see how you like it. Ditto for the XS/F assuming you don’t already own one. Whichever you prefer is likely to remain unchanged by the time Korg release their next board.

Df.

Maybe the name of this thread should have been.....

“Motif XF vs. next Roland workstation”

http://www.rolandconnect.com/

The countdown ends in 06 days 22 hours 7 mins 59 seconds

by the time you read this it would be even less time left.

It seems that Korg is not going to show any new Worstation any time soon, maby thay decided instid of making a little bit better M3 with some minor impruvements like Yamaha did to Motif, thay want to relize comlitly new Workstation, like Oasys 2, so we should wait a year or a bit more?

p.s.
Well I don’t know what thay are thinking, but if i would be Korg, I would do like that…

by the way for now I will stick with kurzweil pc3k8 because I want to see what a new kurzweil K3000 will offer and then I will decide about my next workstation but I am a bit currious what Roland will show in fwe days, but unfortionaly I am pretty shure nothing any special jast a bit impruvet Fantom G with minor futurers, but I would be happy if i am wrong and thay will show something completely new with full 24 bit sound engin and phisical moddeling, bla-bla-bla..... :)

bla-bla…

currently it seems like this is where Korg’s at and personally i dislike it

http://www.korg.co.uk/products/workstations/microstation/ws_microstation.php

http://www.korg.co.uk/products/pro_keyboard/ps60/pk_ps60.php

nickmccullum808 - 24 August 2010 08:48 PM

Korg already has 16 part combis that sound so incredibly lush, do you think their next workstation will be better than the XF?

I just talked with Korg representative and he told me the next Korg M5F will blow motif XF out of the stage…

delirium: “I just talked with Korg representative and he told me the next Korg M5F will blow motif XF out of the stage…”

of course it will! as sure as the unbelievable authentic phantom “fantom gf” will. maybe roland will release a new synth with os 0.4 in september 2010. two years later the consumers will get os version 1.0… ;-)

but for real: i believe in korgs development division. they had damn good ideas in the past - and they will have in the future…
at least: if you are a real musician, the motif xs and the korg m3 are already so highly development instruments that all coming generations are some sort of cosmetic correction.

botega - 25 August 2010 03:25 AM

bla-bla…

currently it seems like this is where Korg’s at and personally i dislike it

http://www.korg.co.uk/products/workstations/microstation/ws_microstation.php


http://www.korg.co.uk/products/pro_keyboard/ps60/pk_ps60.php

yes, i saw that crupp… :(

Hey delirium, you think you’re cool by making up these little kid comments about I just talked korg or I just talked roland and blah blah they told me this and that..c’mon dude...get a life....no one told you anything!

Indulge - 25 August 2010 03:27 PM

Hey delirium, you think you’re cool by making up these little kid comments about I just talked korg or I just talked roland and blah blah they told me this and that..c’mon dude...get a life....no one told you anything!

Easy.. You are the newcomer here and he’s a guru. Not that I post around quiet often, but credits to the ones who deserve it.

Personally, I also don’t like this ‘upgraded XS’.. I’ll also save my money and wait for new Roland / Korg stuff. And I’ll keep my XS8, it seems some interesting updates are on their way.. :)

NAMM’s only 5 months away...I guess we’ll see soon enough if there IS a new Korg workstation in the works.  Personally, I have a sneaking suspicion that the M3 is here to stay for a while.  If you think about it, Korg milked the Triton-series for a good 8 years before replacing it with the all-new M3 back in ‘07.

Roland’s Fantom G is a kick-a$$ workstation that is simply in need of some OS improvements.  Make the sequencer/sampler even easier to use by adding in some desperately needed features that it lacks, include the new patches they’ve been releasing as part of their “Fantom Connects” projects as part of the core system presets, and offer some more ARX boards (that are accessible via MIDI, ideally) and they could milk the FG for another 5 years.  Easily...it’s that advanced.

The XF looks promising--even if it IS little more than just a “souped up XS”, but my beef is the way Yamaha has created their User Interface.  My beef is with its live capabilities.  In the studio, it’s incredible.  I just want things to be a little easier to use LIVE (Performance Mode enhancements).  Give me 8 voices in Performance mode, with octave shift ability of more than 2 octaves and no cut-off of sounds as you change patches/performance sets.  Call me a whiner, but I shouldn’t have to switch into different modes to accomplish this.  Nome sayin?

And love it or hate it, but the new Korg PS60 has some killer sounds.  Feels cheap as hell, but sounds awesome.  An unquestionable replacement to the Triton-based X50.

I agree with the gentlemen that stated the korg M3 76 key has phenominal sound. The korg pianos are wickedly nice however yamaha voices sound the purest!!! i have the Motif xs6 which i dont plan on trading for the new xf. I will probably buy the xf7.
As a musician playing in the gospel realm I can honestly say that thes two synthesizers are the best in the market right now!!! its like being in the best steak house and being in the mood for filet mignon or salmon. “both are great synthesizers. the Motif has features that the korg M3 doesnt so I use either for a specific purpose. I’ve been playing for over twenty years and i was stuck!!! I purchased both. The contempo, vintage 74, and the soft case voices however kicks butt. I find myself reaching more however for the motif!!!!!!!!!

I sometimes play them both together for an arsenal of sound my stack at church is great. i’m giving it up for the Motif but only by a slim margin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

EMANALPHA - 26 August 2010 01:09 PM

I agree with the gentlemen that stated the korg M3 76 key has phenominal sound. The korg pianos are wickedly nice however yamaha voices sound the purest!!! i have the Motif xs6 which i dont plan on trading for the new xf. I will probably buy the xf7.
As a musician playing in the gospel realm I can honestly say that thes two synthesizers are the best in the market right now!!! its like being in the best steak house and being in the mood for filet mignon or salmon. “both are great synthesizers. the Motif has features that the korg M3 doesnt so I use either for a specific purpose. I’ve been playing for over twenty years and i was stuck!!! I purchased both. The contempo, vintage 74, and the soft case voices however kicks butt. I find myself reaching more however for the motif!!!!!!!!!

I sometimes play them both together for an arsenal of sound my stack at church is great. i’m giving it up for the Motif but only by a slim margin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

probablz u did not play kurzweil pc3.... :D

no kurcil whatever I’m good!!!!!!!!

what is kurzweil ?

kday - 24 August 2010 10:53 PM

Maybe the name of this thread should have been.....

“Motif XF vs. next Roland workstation”

http://www.rolandconnect.com/

The countdown ends in 06 days 22 hours 7 mins 59 seconds

by the time you read this it would be even less time left.

That’s weird that companies are breaking tradition of announcing all this stuff at winter namm....Sign of the times?...ZR