Old Motifator threads are available in the Archive.
abdol
Total Posts: 318
Joined 05-30-2012 status: Enthusiast |
It seems you’re internet connection is very poor or you haven’t read my post properly.
You can listen to good quality recorded audio on soundcloud just in case your audio equipments don’t sound good. I audited both keyboards in the store as I stated above. You’re free to believe whatever you believe in that doesn’t change anything.
I’m a poor guy who can’t afford those but at least my contribution is more than just a claim. There are useful material and I assure you both of the keyboards sound almost the same as the recording on the ”soundcloud” which is very close to my ears. I don’t have to prove myself to you then again don’t think everyone will agree with you hope you get it at some point in your life. The SCM to me, sounded like a DSP tweak (as I said before). |
lekanout
Total Posts: 82
Joined 07-19-2007 status: Experienced |
dsetto:
It´s not so easy because of my(non english)native language. You know,during the last years i was lucky to play on stage with kronos,stage 2,motif xf,kurzweil pc3k8...roland rd..and all motifs.. When i’m playing a keyboard,i ‘m always trying to understand how the keybed and engine respond.
I never try to think only about “how the sample react"but “how can i exprim this keyboard”
So many people analyse the samples...i can’t do that.
My vision about piano sound is for the styles i play:
A friend of mîne told me to try the moxf8.
the moxf8 keybed is plastic,but quite usable.
But,i’m the kind of guy who refuse to analyse (like an obsession)to give a chance to every keyboard without analyse modelisation parameters or sample size.
In fact,if you want to tweak modelisation parameters,buy the roland.
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lekanout
Total Posts: 82
Joined 07-19-2007 status: Experienced |
Typically the kind of thing i don’t care:
Typically a sterile forum attitude i absolutly don’t want to have..
Consider your sound vision like you want,no problem follow your way.
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dsetto
Total Posts: 435
Joined 01-24-2014 status: Enthusiast |
lekanout, thanks for your direct comparison of the acoustic pianos between the MOXF8 & CP4. Looking forward to your thoughts after spending time with the MOXF8 acoustic pianos. If anybody has a sense of what I am trying to ask in this thread, and can ask it better, I could use the help. |
dsetto
Total Posts: 435
Joined 01-24-2014 status: Enthusiast |
Has anyone personally compared a 3rd party acoustic piano on a Motif XF8/XS8 or MOXF8 with a CP4 acoustic piano? If so, any thoughts, other than action differences? |
abdol
Total Posts: 318
Joined 05-30-2012 status: Enthusiast |
This basically summarized the whole thing… |
lekanout
Total Posts: 82
Joined 07-19-2007 status: Experienced |
Dsetto:
I’ve played a lot my new MOXF8 since 2 days:
Abdol:
I don’t want to seems superior to you because i am lucky to play with so many synths.
The problem isn’t the fact you can’t have a point of view with utube or souncloud.
But let the power to the player:
The same on stage:
Honestly i didin’t understand why you were so agressive with me,and why you said bad words like i’m ignorant about the rd800(for exemple..while i spent some hours to program the supernatural pianos and eps on it)
So come on abdol,don’t be so hard with the cp series from yamaha!
You can see with my attachment what i’ve done some days ago with my Rd800 for exemple.
Image Attachments
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dsetto
Total Posts: 435
Joined 01-24-2014 status: Enthusiast |
lekanout, my overall sentiments comparing the CP4 vs MOXF8 strictly for the piano experience are like yours, favoring the CP4. This weekend I tore my ACL playing soccer too hard. So, more than ever, I’m preferring the sub 40lb category for a performance instrument. I remain curious about how the acoustic piano sound engine of the CP4 differs from that of the XF/XS/MOXF series. If anyone with some input on this reads this down the line, I’d be glad to hear what you can share. (I’ve even become curious about the scarcity of information on this topic, ;) Regardless of this curioisity, I favor the CP4 because of my positive response to the action married to a capable sound engine, that together get me the various piano experiences I connect with, in a lightweight package. And I remain grateful to Yamaha for the existence of a multitude of products that fit all sorts of my wants. And, I am grateful to all the other instrument (and software instrument) companies as well. (I am not looking for a Yamaha vs “other” thread here. I have attempted to keep this thread focused, so that I (& others interested) can get info on this one subject, that I have not found elsewhere, yet.) |
dsetto
Total Posts: 435
Joined 01-24-2014 status: Enthusiast |
One AP-centric difference that I discovered between the CP4 & XF sound engines is how the CP4 handles fine tuning. The following is my take on this. It relies on my memory of my recent time with the CP4 and I could be wrong in my assessment. On the XF, when you adjust the fine tuning, the entire waveform, as a set, is adjusted. So, if you only have one piano waveform being triggered at one given time, after adjusting the fine tuning away from 0, you won’t make the waveform sound out of tune with itself at that exact moment. (This is assuming there’s no LFO adjusting pitch set up.) On the CP4, when you adjust the fine tuning, I believe, somehow, the sense of the piano not being well in tune is brought in. But, now I forget if it was relative to one pitch at a given moment (like multiple strings on one note), or relative to two different pitches at a given moment (2 different notes not being well in tune), or relative to the same or different pitches at different moments (LFO-like). Regarding the quality of this CP4 pitch fine tune. In my opinion, while adjusting it, & on playback of a recording, I think I can tell it’s digitally derived. However, it can still be musical, both used subtly and even excessively. Sometimes it feels like a subtle (or not so subtle depending upon amount used) chorus effect. And, to me, it’s an important parameter for customization. In my opinion, I believe a user configurable sampled-based piano like the XF8/XS8/MOXF8 beats the CP4 for tasty tuning, & the CP4 will most likely always be what it is, as it is. But, my stance between the two remains in spite of this. |
dsetto
Total Posts: 435
Joined 01-24-2014 status: Enthusiast |
A similar argument between the two can be made regarding sense of space. And this is why, within the Yamaha stable, there is a unique place for each the CP4, MOXF8, and the XF8.
re: my thoughts on AP simulation.
2. XF8: most customizable sound, with satisfying action. (no 3rd sensor, but, in my opinion, not needed because key return is faster than on the CP4, which I think benefits from the 3rd sensor.) A close 2nd to CP4. But loses in AP simulation on action. But, it’s not trying to be solely an AP. It’s a weighted-key synthesizer-sampling workstation that can successfully do all sorts of things, including likely getting real close to a portable piano. 3. MOXF8: lighter, less expensive, smaller alternative to the XF8, with poorer, yet surely respectable action as compared to the XF8, but with the bonus of a nod to graded hammer feel. I believe if I only played the MOXF8 and nothing else for days, I would tune-in to its unique niche of XF8 capabilities under 40lbs, for less. Only then could I give a better report on the MOXF8 action. I still have not spent much time on the MOXF8 to report fairly & balanced on it. But, also, I don’t think I need to, as currently I value touch over satisfyingly customizable pitch & space; the latter being the MOXF8’s strength.
..
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benoit
Total Posts: 173
Joined 08-19-2009 status: Pro |
Hi
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cmayhle
Total Posts: 3116
Joined 10-05-2011 status: Guru |
I can’t comment on the technical nuances of the sample vs. modelling stuff...I simply don’t have the engineering background for that...but it doesn’t matter to me, as I know what I like when I hear it (as others have stated). I own both the XF8 and the CP4 (among other machines), and although approximately a year ago when the CP4 first came out I had a real problem with the hard-strike samples on a few specific notes (See This Thread), I bought one and have absolutely no regrets about the purchase. The samples in question still bug me, but I have learned how to mitigate them in the CP4 setup...and really the rest of the CP4 sound and playing experience is so excellent I admit is helps me overlook the flaw. I would recommend you keep the XF7 and compliment it with the CP4...for your acoustic piano playing if for nothing else. I am not the only native piano player who believes you would then own one of the best two-keyboard set-ups you could have. |
digitalperformer7
Total Posts: 253
Joined 12-07-2011 status: Enthusiast |
As a CP4 and XF7 owner, I was harshly critcized by several participants of an Italian forum. Perhaps they were just envious or think a stage piano must necessarily be heavy.
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TAE
Total Posts: 8
Joined 10-10-2009 status: Newcomer |
Lekanout You are a VERY patient dude. Having the opportunity to actually work in the Music Marketing side of the business gives clarity to the smoke n mirrors hype that is the nature of the beast of marketing and sales. Your arguments and explanations as to why you wanted to go with the moxf8 even though you own a CP4 were great. When someone comes in and blatantly and naively states that the yamaha piano sounds suck that is drawing a line in the sand and saying cross over it and we have a fight...Which is exactly what happened...You were very patient and very polite in trying to let him know that in the end it is a subjective thing, fords and chevys. And for that elequent response you were rewarded with more piss and vinegar. Gotta kind of wonder what a Yamaha hater is doing in the Motif community. Loved your analogy of being a little kid getting your new MOXF8...I so get that..I’m a hack player that LOVES playing. If i put two different keyboards next to each other and play them both I may enjoy playing one over the other but I can get joy out of playing a pretty crappy piano if that’s all that is available...piano snobs...pffft! I own the older mox8 and LOVE IT! I also own a Nord Electro 4 and Oh My God it is like night and day listening to the piano sounds of the electro vs the Mox, the yamaha piano sounds are soooooo much nicer (subjectively speaking ;) ) that said....I can live with playing the Nord if my MOX isn’t around.. Just wanted to say I think you dealt with the hater pretty well...All the best! |
Dionysos
Total Posts: 46
Joined 01-07-2018 status: Regular |
So today 2018 would you still say I am fine with MoxF8 which I bought due to revviews/commentaries (liking it to be an economic version of the Motif)? I am a piano composer so some might say I ought to buy the cp4 but I got from cp5 over dgx660 (ok easy apart from some hurdles) to the Moxf8. My objective is to be an advanced all around composer, and I find dgx660 to limit me in that. Any words? Please no sales talk without heart. I want an easy way of making music and I want the sound to be great. I have found the moxf8 acoustic sound to be crappy on some lukas nano 300 pa. But on the headphones not so bad. Please any commentaries to make me know whether my choice was good or bad. I am new to synths but I like the synth sounds and find them necessary for my music. But also I am a simple musician who likes simplicity and a superb sound. |