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Viewing topic "The friendship of allies"

   
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Posted on: February 06, 2009 @ 08:13 AM
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Re: The friendship of allies

Well, I thought you might be able to come up with a bit more than simple generalizations regarding the matter.....So be it.

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Posted on: February 06, 2009 @ 11:15 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

Open mouth, insert foot here

He offers nothing from himself.....no grace, no love, no indwelling spirtual and living relationship......he only demands human performance. He does offer carnal rewards for performance that is up to standard, but again this is transparently absurd and is spiritually moot because the offer only concerns itself with mans’ desires

As opposed to christian faith, where all sins are forgiven, and heavenly reward is given to all who repent? Christian heaven is not a human desire and reward?

The man made concept of Allah is simply an extension of the humanist view that leaves the attempts at upright morality in the hands of men...this, in the end, is futile.

Second foot. Both OT and NT written by regular men to have supposedly been inspired by a god. These authors moral agendas also changed from OT to NT, there are many examples of this. But we are hyjacking this thread now.

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Posted on: February 06, 2009 @ 09:58 PM
scotch
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Re: The friendship of allies

[gutwrench] Pedophiles and murders should be tortured. A job I would thoroughly enjoy for myself. One day my dream might come true.

This is really beyond the pale. Not only is torture illegal according to the United Nations and the Geneva Convention; it is also specifically proscribed by the United States Constitution. Gutwrench’s attitude is fundamentally anti-American--to say nothing of pathological.

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Posted on: February 07, 2009 @ 12:35 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

Gutwrench’s attitude is fundamentally anti-American--to say nothing of pathological.

Pathological? maybe

Anti-American? No it ain’t!

/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif alt=

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Posted on: February 08, 2009 @ 05:11 PM
scotch
Total Posts:  2027
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Re: The friendship of allies

The eighth amendment to the United States Constituion, ratified as part of the Bill or Rights in 1791: Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

Supreme Court Justice William Brennan in Furman v. Georgia: “There are, then, four principles by which we may determine whether a particular punishment is ‘cruel and unusual’.
The primary principle, which I believe supplies the essential predicate for the application of the others, is that a punishment must not by its severity be degrading to human dignity. The paradigm violation of this principle would be the infliction of a torturous punishment of the type that the Clause has always prohibited.

From the Initial Report submitted to the Committee against Torture by the United States submitted in 1999 (CAT/C/28/Add.5):

Torture is prohibited by law throughout the United States. It is categorically denounced as a matter of policy and as a tool of state authority. Every act constituting torture under the Convention constitutes a criminal offence under the law of the United States. No official of the Government, federal, state or local, civilian or military, is authorized to commit or to instruct anyone else to commit torture. Nor may any official condone or tolerate torture in any form. No exceptional circumstances may be invoked as a justification of torture. United States law contains no provision permitting otherwise prohibited acts of torture or other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment to be employed on grounds of exigent circumstances (for example, during a “state of public emergency") or on orders from a superior officer or public authority, and the protective mechanisms of an independent judiciary are not subject to suspension. The United States is committed to the full and effective implementation of its obligations under the Convention throughout its territory.


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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 01:13 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

Scotch it was just a wisecrack. Sometimes your seriousness is torture. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif alt=

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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 01:52 AM
hamletmaschine
Total Posts:  996
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Re: The friendship of allies

Erm, aren’t wisecracks supposed to be funny?

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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 02:02 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

aren’t wisecracks supposed to be funny?

Erm no, otherwise I would have said it was supposed to be a joke.


wise·crack n. A flippant, typically sardonic remark or retort.

Now quit picking on me you two /forums/images/icons/crazy.gif alt=

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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 06:56 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

(CNN)—

Khadr, now 22, is the youngest inmate and, as a Canadian citizen, the only Westerner still held at Gitmo. He is accused of receiving one-on-one training from al Qaeda and was allegedly caught on a surveillance video making and planting roadside bombs where U.S. troops traveled—video the Pentagon will not release.

Due to go to trial last month, Khadr is charged with war crimes including murder, spying, conspiracy and providing support to terrorism. But President Obama’s order to close the detention facility at Gitmo has postponed the trial, and left the case in limbo.

Like the other remaining 245 Gitmo detainees, Khadr could be tried in the United States and face a life sentence. Or he might be sent back to Canada, where he could avoid trial and be......


set free.

/forums/images/icons/confused.gif alt=

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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 07:27 PM
hamletmaschine
Total Posts:  996
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Re: The friendship of allies

I’ve highlighted the most important words in the quotation:

Like the other remaining 245 Gitmo detainees, Khadr could be tried in the United States and face a life sentence. Or he might be sent back to Canada, where he could avoid trial

I don’t think that anyone on this forum, me certainly included, wants to see criminals on the loose. The point is that in the West we have something called law and order which prescribes the way that we dispense justice. A violation of those codes is a violation of our moral authority and makes us just as criminal as those we seek to punish. If there is evidence to indict this man, then let it be used in a proper court, not in a network of now apparently closed secret prisons and a highly suspect facility on Cuba.

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Posted on: February 09, 2009 @ 11:44 PM
sciuriware
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Re: The friendship of allies

Well said!

If there was any evidence against those prisoners ........
..... but was there any evidence against Iraq?

Remains: if terrorists succeed in making us terrorists .... they have won.

;JOOP!

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Posted on: February 10, 2009 @ 12:19 PM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, its probably not a cow.

Sleep tight

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Posted on: February 10, 2009 @ 12:54 PM
scotch
Total Posts:  2027
Joined  08-14-2005
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Re: The friendship of allies

Have you ever been to court? Have you ever been accused of a crime? Do you have the slightest practical experience of any of this? I’ll let you on in a little secret: Even under normal domestic circumstances the chances that someone accused of a crime really committed it are only about fifty percent. When you round up prisoners randomly the chances decrease dramatically.

[gutwrench] Scotch it was just a wisecrack.

What was a wisecrack? That you don’t consider yourself anti-American? That you want to torture people yourself? That you think prisoners should be tortured? That you don’t believe those accused of crimes are entitled to a fair trial? That you don’t believe in the rule of law?

So, whatever it was, it wasn’t supposed to be amusing? Was it supposed to be cute or in any way endearing? Is anything you’ve said in this thread supposed to be anything other than thoroughly reprehensible?
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Posted on: February 11, 2009 @ 12:39 AM
MoGut
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Re: The friendship of allies

I’ll let you on in a little secret: Even under normal domestic circumstances the chances that someone accused of a crime really committed it are only about fifty percent

source?

A quick search on the net reflects statistics to the contrary

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Posted on: February 11, 2009 @ 01:52 AM
sciuriware
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Re: The friendship of allies

Well, might be right; my personal %-age is indeed 50% !!!!!!!!!

;JOOP!

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